ICE Barbie is out at DHS

[HDGristle]

Originally Posted by lustylad

I didn't bring up any "personal embarrassments".

Lie to yourself as needed, Lusty. It's for the course and still not relevant

Folks from Trump World have been spilling plenty of tea about her mismanagement of DHS since the news broke.

[lustylad]

Originally Posted by lustylad

Once again, I didn't bring up any "personal embarrassments". You did. I merely noted Kristi's husband is a cross-dresser. You're the one who immediately labeled this revelation as "super-embarrassing". Please don't try to deflect your trans-phobic bigotry onto me. Why can't you be more tolerant of the trans community?

Originally Posted by HDGristle

Lie to yourself as needed, Lusty. It's for the course and still not relevant

The only people lying to themselves are you and jayzee. I suppose you could always try to retract your comments and say you don't consider it embarrassing. Not sure anyone would believe you at this point, though.

[fd-guy]

Originally Posted by lustylad

Seriously? You want to compare data? Be my guest!

There have been countless threads in this sandbox talking about the number of illegals who poured across the border under Autopen. When DHS tells us the numbers nosedived by over 90% soon after Trump and Kristi came in, are you really prepared to challenge those numbers?

Go ahead - be my guest. Show us your data.

It's only a "trick" because you don't like seeing your hypocrisy exposed. For the third (or is it fourth?) time, I didn't force anyone to react in a trans-phobic fashion. They chose to do that all by themselves!

The numbers are accurate – no one disputes that border encounters have declined substantially. The interesting aspect to consider here is that the decline didn’t begin on January 20th. Biden's June 2024 executive action on asylum resulted in encounters decreasing by more than 60% prior to Trump even taking office. This is a trend as much as it is a result. Interesting how this aspect is never discussed.

Accusing Kristi Noem in particular is doing a lot of work when she is no longer at DHS. It is hard to own the scoreboard when you are no longer in the game.

If you are a follower of 'follow the data wherever it leads,' then you have to do so even when it is inconvenient. Selective scorekeeping is not analysis – it is cheerleading.

On the subject of winning — declaring victory in an argument is a lot like declaring victory in a war. It tends to mean more when someone other than you is saying it. You and the 12 time victory declaring cult leader seem to have a lot in common there.

Regarding your trans comment – still a circle. Still your grenade.

[Charley3]

Well her hubby does have a right to strap on big ol fake boobies and send the pics through the internet it certainly opened her up to possible blackmail.
Did anyone vet this chick before hiring her???!!! Amazing.

[fd-guy]

Originally Posted by lustylad

The only people lying to themselves are you and jayzee. I suppose you could always try to retract your comments and say you don't consider it embarrassing. Not sure anyone would believe you at this point, though.

"Anyone" is doing a lot of work again. Are you the elected representative of anyone, or is that just a habit?

[jayzee43]

Originally Posted by lustylad

Wrong!

Most of the budget was for DHS advertising. Do you know how expensive it is to create ads and buy air time for those ads? It's called MESSAGING. Let all those illegals know Kristi's DHS will generously help pay for the air fare if they self-deport. Funny how you missed my earlier comment about how much Kristi saved taxpayers by getting the message out!

So you're going to jump right in with Gristle and project your own deep inner feelings of embarrassment onto Kristi Noem, even though she has expressed no such emotions?

Seems to me the REAL HYPOCRITES are the folks who pretend to love trannies, but then openly label it as a huge "embarrassment" if anyone on their political hate list has a family member who is trans.

Lol. Where have I ever claimed to love trannies? Please show me. Just because MAGA is a monolith that can't survive without group-think doesn't mean the rest of us are in a cult, too.

In fact, I've posted on this forum my opinions of transgender folks in the past, and they align more with the center-right than they do the far left.

And the $220 million ICE Barbie wasted on hair extensions, horsey rides and law enforcement cosplay saved us $39 billion? That's fucking hilarious and completely without merit. Nobody can point to any serious study that concludes that.

Hypocrisy, pure and simple.

[lustylad]

Originally Posted by jayzee43

And the $220 million ICE Barbie wasted on hair extensions, horsey rides and law enforcement cosplay saved us $39 billion? That's fucking hilarious and completely without merit. Nobody can point to any serious study that concludes that.

Once again, the $200 million was for an ad campaign, not for Kristi Noem's hair extensions. Stop being daft. The money went to the advertising companies that produced the ads and the tv networks who ran them.

As for the claim it saved taxpayers $39 billion, I furnished you with a link supporting that claim. If you had opened and read it, you would have noticed the arithmetic is simple & straightforward. Anyone with a 5th-grade math proficiency can follow it.

Let's recap, shall we?

An estimated 2.2 million illegals have self-deported since Kristi Noem took over at DHS. That means they didn't have to be arrested and deported by ICE. The DHS notes that "on average, an arrest and removal by Immigration and Customs Enforcement (ICE) costs U.S. taxpayers $18,000."

So getting all those illegals to self-deport under Kristi's innovative "DHS Home Mobile App" saved taxpayers $18k a pop. How much does that add up to? Multiply 2.2 million by $18k and presto - you get $39.6 billion!

Kristi's brilliant app allows self-deportees to collect an "exit bonus" of up to $2,600 to help cover the air fare to return to their home countries. So if you want to nitpick, you can deduct that amount from the $18k-per-illegal savings. Even then, the total savings to taxpayers works out to a hefty $33.9 billion!

Now if you want to object by asking - how do we know those self-deportees wouldn't have left anyway? Does Kristi's ad campaign deserve all the credit? I would say ok, then let's (generously) assume only half of them would have gone home anyway, while the other half were motivated by the DHS App and the exit bonus they learned about thanks to Kristi's creative ad campaign. In that case, the total savings to taxpayers would still be nearly $17 billion - or 85 TIMES the cost of the ad campaign.

Seems like money well spent to me!!

Sorry, Jayzee. Calling something "fucking hilarious and completely without merit" without doing an ounce of research or homework of your own doesn't persuade anyone of anything.

Try to do better, k?

[jayzee43]

Money well spent? ICE Barbie's hair extensions and horsey rides and law enforcement cosplay? Money well spent?

If this had been done by anyone other than trump, you'd be flipping your shit.

The idea that anyone claims this saved the American taxpayers $39 billion is embarrassing. Not even in the realm of reality.

[lustylad]

Originally Posted by jayzee43

The idea that anyone claims this saved the American taxpayers $39 billion is embarrassing. Not even in the realm of reality.

I just explained it to you. Walked you right through the math. Were any of my calculations incorrect? Your lame dismissal is embarrassing!

Wanna try again?

[jayzee43]

Embarrassing. My "lame dismissal" is just reality settling in. Little Miss Hair Extensions got fired because she saved the taxpayers $39 billion?

Um, no. That's not even close to being true.

[fd-guy]

Originally Posted by lustylad

Once again, the $200 million was for an ad campaign, not for Kristi Noem's hair extensions. Stop being daft. The money went to the advertising companies that produced the ads and the tv networks who ran them.

As for the claim it saved taxpayers $39 billion, I furnished you with a link supporting that claim. If you had opened and read it, you would have noticed the arithmetic is simple & straightforward. Anyone with a 5th-grade math proficiency can follow it.

Let's recap, shall we?

An estimated 2.2 million illegals have self-deported since Kristi Noem took over at DHS. That means they didn't have to be arrested and deported by ICE. The DHS notes that "on average, an arrest and removal by Immigration and Customs Enforcement (ICE) costs U.S. taxpayers $18,000."

So getting all those illegals to self-deport under Kristi's innovative "DHS Home Mobile App" saved taxpayers $18k a pop. How much does that add up to? Multiply 2.2 million by $18k and presto - you get $39.6 billion!

Kristi's brilliant app allows self-deportees to collect an "exit bonus" of up to $2,600 to help cover the air fare to return to their home countries. So if you want to nitpick, you can deduct that amount from the $18k-per-illegal savings. Even then, the total savings to taxpayers works out to a hefty $33.9 billion!

Now if you want to object by asking - how do we know those self-deportees wouldn't have left anyway? Does Kristi's ad campaign deserve all the credit? I would say ok, then let's (generously) assume only half of them would have gone home anyway, while the other half were motivated by the DHS App and the exit bonus they learned about thanks to Kristi's creative ad campaign. In that case, the total savings to taxpayers would still be nearly $17 billion - or 85 TIMES the cost of the ad campaign.

Seems like money well spent to me!!

Sorry, Jayzee. Calling something "fucking hilarious and completely without merit" without doing an ounce of research or homework of your own doesn't persuade anyone of anything.

Try to do better, k?

The math is easy—it's the numbers you're plugging in that are the issue. That 2.2 million "self-deportations" DHS loves quoting? It comes from a Center for Immigration Studies report crunching Current Population Survey data. Brookings straight-up said that data "should not be considered a serious source for estimating net migration." Meanwhile, the Center for Migration Studies (totally different group) puts the real self-deportation number at about 200,000. One-tenth of DHS's claim.

And Kristi's big "Project Homecoming" app? Yeah, 72,000 people have used it. Most were already locked up in ICE detention when they signed on. That's not self-deportation; that's just deportation with an app slapped on the paperwork.

So sure, the math adds up perfectly... if you swallow a number experts say is bloated 10x over, based on junk data Brookings won't touch, to "save" money on deportations that were happening regardless.

Fifth-grade arithmetic only shines if your inputs aren't garbage. GIGO, no matter how confidently you multiply.

Keep swinging! We admire the effort.

[lustylad]

Originally Posted by fd-guy

The math is easy—it's the numbers you're plugging in that are the issue. That 2.2 million "self-deportations" DHS loves quoting? It comes from a Center for Immigration Studies report crunching Current Population Survey data. Brookings straight-up said that data "should not be considered a serious source for estimating net migration." Meanwhile, the Center for Migration Studies (totally different group) puts the real self-deportation number at about 200,000. One-tenth of DHS's claim.

And Kristi's big "Project Homecoming" app? Yeah, 72,000 people have used it. Most were already locked up in ICE detention when they signed on. That's not self-deportation; that's just deportation with an app slapped on the paperwork.

So sure, the math adds up perfectly... if you swallow a number experts say is bloated 10x over, based on junk data Brookings won't touch, to "save" money on deportations that were happening regardless.

Fifth-grade arithmetic only shines if your inputs aren't garbage. GIGO, no matter how confidently you multiply.

Well, at least I will give you kudos for trying to engage in substantive debate, unlike certain other libs in this thread.

To summarize... you reject a number from a think tank that supports legal immigration (the Center for Immigration Studies), in favor of a number plucked from a left-wing non-profit that supports illegal immigration (the Center for Migrant Studies of New York City)? And you insist only the latter group employs so-called "experts" who deserve to be taken seriously?

I can play that game too. I can just as reasonably insist your cherry-picked number is UNDERSTATED 10x over, and my own estimate is more accurate since it was derived by REAL EXPERTS. But I will refrain from doing so, because in all honesty and fairness I haven't seen the study by the Center for Migrant Studies of New York City that you deem to be correct. Of course, if you really had confidence in this so-called "expert" source, I'm sure you would have furnished a link to it, along with a link to the liberal Brookings Institution article dismissing the CIS data.

One big problem you have is that the CIS estimates are supported not only by Andrew Arthur (who has 33 years of experience in studying trends in legal and illegal immigration), but also by the Federal Reserve, the Bureau of Labor Statistics, the Congressional Budget Office, the Pew Research Center, the Wall Street Journal, and a host of well-regarded US labor economists. Are you sure you want to cast shade on ALL of them?

Each of these sources (and let's not forget to throw in Fed Chairman Jerome Powell for good measure) has drawn attention to the dramatic shift in the labor market since Trump took office, as the foreign-born portion of the US labor force has been shrinking. This was already noted way back last Summer, when Andrew Arthur's colleagues (Steve Camarata and Karen Ziegler) issued a widely cited report estimating the illegal immigrant population already declined by 1.6 million between January and July 2025. If that earlier estimate is correct, I don't think it would be a stretch at all for the number to have swelled further in the 8 months since then.

Here are a couple of posts where I quoted Andrew Arthur and the self-deportation estimates that were being bandied about last Summer:

https://eccie.net/showpost.php?p=106...&postcount=331

https://eccie.net/showpost.php?p=106...&postcount=341


And here is an excellent column where Andrew Arthur defends the CIS estimates against ankle-biting liberal doubters:

https://cis.org/Arthur/Curious-Debat...elfDeportation

[bambino]

Thoughts on Tulsi ..

I really like her I think she’s done an excellent job.

https://x.com/gracieback2/status/204...889685887?s=42

[jayzee43]

Originally Posted by bambino

Thoughts on Tulsi ..

I really like her I think she’s done an excellent job.

https://x.com/gracieback2/status/204...889685887?s=42

But as soon as trump shitcans her, it'll be all "good riddance". There's not a speck of loyalty anywhere to be found in trumpworld - other than to dear leader himself.

[fd-guy]

Originally Posted by lustylad

Well, at least I will give you kudos for trying to engage in substantive debate, unlike certain other libs in this thread.

To summarize... you reject a number from a think tank that supports legal immigration (the Center for Immigration Studies), in favor of a number plucked from a left-wing non-profit that supports illegal immigration (the Center for Migrant Studies of New York City)? And you insist only the latter group employs so-called "experts" who deserve to be taken seriously?

I can play that game too. I can just as reasonably insist your cherry-picked number is UNDERSTATED 10x over, and my own estimate is more accurate since it was derived by REAL EXPERTS. But I will refrain from doing so, because in all honesty and fairness I haven't seen the study by the Center for Migrant Studies of New York City that you deem to be correct. Of course, if you really had confidence in this so-called "expert" source, I'm sure you would have furnished a link to it, along with a link to the liberal Brookings Institution article dismissing the CIS data.

One big problem you have is that the CIS estimates are supported not only by Andrew Arthur (who has 33 years of experience in studying trends in legal and illegal immigration), but also by the Federal Reserve, the Bureau of Labor Statistics, the Congressional Budget Office, the Pew Research Center, the Wall Street Journal, and a host of well-regarded US labor economists. Are you sure you want to cast shade on ALL of them?

Each of these sources (and let's not forget to throw in Fed Chairman Jerome Powell for good measure) has drawn attention to the dramatic shift in the labor market since Trump took office, as the foreign-born portion of the US labor force has been shrinking. This was already noted way back last Summer, when Andrew Arthur's colleagues (Steve Camarata and Karen Ziegler) issued a widely cited report estimating the illegal immigrant population already declined by 1.6 million between January and July 2025. If that earlier estimate is correct, I don't think it would be a stretch at all for the number to have swelled further in the 8 months since then.

Here are a couple of posts where I quoted Andrew Arthur and the self-deportation estimates that were being bandied about last Summer:

https://eccie.net/showpost.php?p=106...&postcount=331

https://eccie.net/showpost.php?p=106...&postcount=341


And here is an excellent column where Andrew Arthur defends the CIS estimates against ankle-biting liberal doubters:

https://cis.org/Arthur/Curious-Debat...elfDeportation

Your kudos are completely meaningless to me. Save them for someone that considers you worthy of looking up to.

The "both sides have bias" point is discredited straight off the bat. The Center for Migration Studies is an academic research institution. The Center for Immigration Studies was established by white nationalist John Tanton specifically as a spin-off of FAIR as a way of lending intellectual credibility to immigration restrictionist policies. Its methodology has been called into question by the Cato Institute, Urban Institute, PolitiFact, FactCheck.org, the Washington Post, and the National Academies of Sciences. Not exactly a leftist conspiracy.

Brookings criticized the claim based on the validity of its statistics. Using differences of differences calculated from surveys produces unreliable results. This is a matter of methodology, not politics. Separate the two.

The Fed, BLS, and Pew saw a drop in the foreign-born workforce. But that is not a confirmation of self-deportation numbers being accurate or even existing. Noticing a trend does not validate a particular number. Again, two distinct points.

The foreign-born population dropped. No one argued otherwise. But there was debate about whether the number cited by DHS was accurate. This is what they were debating.

I realize that distinction may be lost on someone purposely avoiding it. I don't have any interest in reading the other weighty tomes of misinformation you linked.