More Racist White Folks in the GOP

[Jacuzzme]

I get it just fine. Worked with black guys from the hood my entire career who said fuck this, I’m not gonna participate in this ghetto shit, got some skills, worked hard and are currently thriving. One of them and his wife are godparents to one of my kids.

[1blackman1]

I get it. You have black friends.

[Jacuzzme]

Former coworkers mostly. The difference between you and I is that I see them as men, not some political prop to whine about, and judge them by the content of their character not their melanin levels. Some smart guy said that’s how it’s done, and he was right. He’s currently rolling over in his grave.

[rooster]

Originally Posted by Jacuzzme

I get it just fine. Worked with black guys from the hood my entire career who said fuck this, I’m not gonna participate in this ghetto shit, got some skills, worked hard and are currently thriving. One of them and his wife are godparents to one of my kids.

Sounds like a sample too small to be meaningful.

Originally Posted by 1blackman1

I get it. You have black friends.

Originally Posted by Jacuzzme

Former coworkers mostly. The difference between you and I is that I see them as men, not some political prop to whine about, and judge them by the content of their character not their melanin levels. Some smart guy said that’s how it’s done, and he was right. He’s currently rolling over in his grave.

He didn't say anything like that. Some of the more MAGA folk here kinda went that way. Not you. You were doing just fine arguing your disagreement. His statement may have been a dig. But your reply is beneath you.

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[Turner2099]

Originally Posted by Tiny

Duh. There are a lot fewer blacks in America than whites. Taking your faulty reasoning to an extreme, if you had 100,000 blacks in America and 200 million whites, then the odds of a black person being killed by a white person would be off the charts high compared to the reverse.

From your numbers you apparently don't understand "Whites" in the FBI table include most Hispanics. The 197 million number you used is the population of non-Hispanic whites. But that's neither here nor there.

If you define "white" as including Hispanic whites, then the there are 1.1 blacks per million whites killed annually by whites:

246/228,000,000 x 1,000,000 = 1.1

And there are 13.8 whites per million blacks killed annually by blacks:

566/41,000,000 x 1,000,000 = 13.8

So it looks like blacks kill whites at a rate 13X higher adjusted for relative populations.

And yeah, you're right, this is inconsequential, 566 white deaths per year, relative to the lost years suffered by blacks as a result of poor healthcare outcomes and incarceration.

I'm out of here. I'm burning too much time in this thread and I haven't got any converts. I had my hopes up with you Turner, but I'm throwing in the towel.

FBI statistics from 2019 we both were using:

https://ucr.fbi.gov/crime-in-the-u.s...ta-table-6.xls

Originally Posted by Turner2099

-However, on a per capita basis, Black Americans faced roughly twice the risk of being killed by a white offender compared to the reverse, largely because the Black population is about 1/5 the size of the white population.

You're right about there being more white people than black people and I pointed that out in my post.

It's not faulty reasoning--odds are odds and I used real figures.

You're right about the white overall population size. I did not realize the 197 million only captured non-Hispanic whites. This is exactly why I asked you what question you asked ChatGPT when it gave you an answer that led you to see no need to discuss systemic racism. It didn't even occur to me that Claude wouldn't use apples-to-apples in it's calculations, so I wasn't specific enough in my question.

Yes, the result is neither here nor there. If the odds are recalculated using the correct numbers, it's basically a rounding issue---there's no change to the percentage.

White killed by Black offender: 566
Population at Risk: ~228 million
Odds of being killed by a black person: 1 in 403,000 or 0.0003%

You make a great point by showing that blacks kill whites by a rate 13x greater than whites kill blacks. It sounds like a crazy number, but as you know, it is an exaggerated threat if you don't include the underlying numbers.

That was my point.

Using 2019 numbers, the chance of a white person being killed by a black person is 0.0003%.

When you say 566 white deaths per year is inconsequential relative to the lost years suffered by blacks as a result of poor healthcare outcomes and incarceration, you're making an understatement.

Poor healthcare outcomes and high incarceration rates aren't just in the past---these are ongoing issues. These are outcomes of systemic racism. This is where I am trying to gain converts---systemic racism must be discussed.

[Lantern2814]

Jacuzzme is correct. It's not difficult to get out of the poverty cycle. No matter where you are from. Young men need to have the courage to resist the peer pressure they'll get (and yes, it's mostly young black men who get this) from others saying they're "forgetting where they're from", or "trying to be white" because they want an education and to get themselves and their families OUT of poverty and break the cycle. The ones who work hard and refuse to accept the narrative that there's no escape will make a success of themselves.

[txdot-guy]

Originally Posted by Lantern2814

Jacuzzme is correct. It's not difficult to get out of the poverty cycle. No matter where you are from. Young men need to have the courage to resist the peer pressure they'll get (and yes, it's mostly young black men who get this) from others saying they're "forgetting where they're from", or "trying to be white" because they want an education and to get themselves and their families OUT of poverty and break the cycle. The ones who work hard and refuse to accept the narrative that there's no escape will make a success of themselves.

While this sounds like it’s true it’s only true for most of Americans. There are plenty of places in America where no matter how hard you work you simply can’t get ahead or escape generational poverty. And that’s occurring for rural whites more and more as factory jobs and the communities that relied on them have moved their factories overseas.

[rooster]

Originally Posted by txdot-guy

While this sounds like it’s true it’s only true for most of Americans. There are plenty of places in America where no matter how hard you work you simply can’t get ahead or escape generational poverty. And that’s occurring for rural whites more and more as factory jobs and the communities that relied on them have moved their factories overseas.

Everyone that says the opposite is just proving their ignorance of the big picture. They've never lived this. And they know few people...if any...who actually have.

Think differently? Tell me a story. I've got bunches. And they won't go where you think.

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[Lantern2814]

So according to some, no matter how hard you work you're going to be a failure. You can't ever make anything of yourself. You can't ever get out of poverty. THAT is a racist attitude. And usually spouted by Democrats. Who never had the motivation, work ethic, or guts to ignore the comments of their peers and actually put the work in. Much easier to complain about the situation while doing nothing to help yourself. People who refuse to buy into the naysayers can (and the vast majority of the time do) break the cycle and get themselves and their families out of the ghetto and into a nice neighborhood (and that doesn't mean a "white" neighborhood only before the usual "racist" cries start).

[Jacuzzme]

Originally Posted by Lantern2814

So according to some, no matter how hard you work you're going to be a failure. You can't ever make anything of yourself. You can't ever get out of poverty. THAT is a racist attitude.

It’s called soft bigotry.

[txdot-guy]

Originally Posted by Lantern2814

So according to some, no matter how hard you work you're going to be a failure. You can't ever make anything of yourself. You can't ever get out of poverty. THAT is a racist attitude.

It’s not racism it’s reality. And I never said that hard work won’t get you places. What I said is that sometimes despite your best effort and work ethic life will take a dump all over you. When that happens if you don’t have other resources or family members that you can fall back on then you can be plunged right back into poverty.

It’s called generational poverty. It occurs when people don’t have the resources to spring back from unexpected disasters. Like cancer or a life altering illness or a catastrophic car accident.

Those kinds of circumstances can’t always be overcome just by hard work. This is why a good social safety net is essential to a healthy economy.

Sometimes people need a hand up and not a talking down to.