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Old 10-26-2025, 05:19 PM   #46
HDGristle
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Share the "real" #'s
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Old 10-26-2025, 06:05 PM   #47
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Default Extra, Extra, Read All About It - the Dems Are Lying In a Desperate Attempt to Prop Up and "Save" Obamacare!!

Did they forget to mention the fact that the enhanced ACA subsidies were passed entirely by Dems (in 2021-22 when they controlled both Houses of Congress) as an "emergency" covid-relief measure?

Did they neglect to mention how they (the Dems) voted for them to expire at end-2025? Now they've shut down the Government because... (wait for it... drumroll...) ...they've changed their minds?

Did they forget to tell you the original ACA subsidies will remain intact even after the expiration of the enhanced subsidies?

Did they forget to mention the enhanced subsidies are ridiculously generous - available even for people with annual incomes up to $600,000?

Why would they NOT tell you everything? As Paul Harvey would say, "Here is the REST OF THE STORY"!


https://www.cato.org/blog/six-reason...care-subsidies


At the center of the government shutdown is a disagreement over whether to extend a temporary pandemic-era expansion of the Affordable Care Act’s premium tax credits. These subsidies cover health insurance premiums for the roughly 7 percent of Americans who use the government-run Obamacare insurance marketplace. Sold as a temporary boost during the COVID-19 pandemic, the subsidies are costly, fraud-prone, and primarily pad insurance companies’ profits.

While the pandemic plus-up expires at the end of 2025, the originally designed Obamacare subsidy is permanent. The temporary expansion, enacted under the American Rescue Plan Act and later extended by the Inflation Reduction Act, increased the size and made the subsidies more widely available.

Here are six reasons Congress should not extend the inflated pandemic insurance subsidies:

1. Costs Almost Half a Trillion Dollars.

2. Funds the Well-Off.

3. Subsidizes Insurance Companies, not Patients.

4. Rampant Enrollment Fraud.

5. High Cost for Little Patient Value.

6. Temporary Emergencies Should Not Justify Permanent Entitlements.


(Click on the link for details of each of the above 6 points.)


Conclusion:

Biden’s pandemic-era Obamacare premium subsidies were sold as temporary relief but have instead produced fraud, phantom enrollees, and subsidies for wealthy taxpayers who don’t need them. The program funnels billions of taxpayer dollars to insurers and middlemen while distorting the individual market and doing little to expand meaningful access to care.
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Old 10-26-2025, 06:11 PM   #48
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Share the "real" #'s
Total Emergency Medicaid spending (FY 2017–2023): $27 billion (federal and state combined), of which a portion covers undocumented immigrants.
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Old 10-26-2025, 06:28 PM   #49
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What's the portion? And does it actually cover undocumented or is it a capped reimbursement for required care regardless of citizenship status because of a Reagan Era rule?
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Old 10-26-2025, 06:41 PM   #50
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What's the portion? And does it actually cover undocumented or is it a capped reimbursement for required care regardless of citizenship status because of a Reagan Era rule?
You find out. Those numbers probably aren’t accurate anyways. Bribes let in 20 million illegals. Respond to Lusty’s post while you’re at it.
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Old 10-26-2025, 06:49 PM   #51
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Default Dems Are Caught Lying and Scare-Mongering Again!!

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Originally Posted by txdot-guy View Post
Do at a little research please.

The issue at hand is the enhanced ACA subsidies... Costs are likely to double for everyone.

Here's a little research for you, txdot:


ObamaCare Premiums Are Doubling? Don’t Believe It

The Democrats’ latest scare is based on a misleading study.


By Chris Jacobs
Oct. 20, 2025 5:26 pm ET


As the government shutdown drags on, Democrats claim that “premiums will double” if enhanced ObamaCare subsidies expire as scheduled on Dec. 31. That would be shocking if it were true, but it isn’t. The misleading claim is based on research by KFF, formerly the Kaiser Family Foundation. It ignores the sizable subsidy that the federal government will still provide to most exchange enrollees if the enhanced subsidies expire and overstates the expiration’s effect on most households.

On Aug. 6, KFF published an analysis showing “a median proposed premium increase of 18%” for insurers’ exchange plans. But on Sept. 30, several of the same researchers issued a second report with a headline asserting that “premium payments would more than double” if enhanced subsidies expire. What happened? Did premium estimates for 2026 rise sixfold in one month?

No. KFF’s second study was misleading. It used cleverly parsed terms—“premium payments” rather than “premiums”—to conflate total premiums with enrollees’ out-of-pocket payments. The two aren’t the same. Focusing on the latter to the exclusion of the former, as the September study did, omits important context.

And the researchers know it. I asked Cynthia Cox, a KFF vice president, about a graphic on the foundation’s home page warning “premiums will more than double.” Ms. Cox acknowledged the claim was inaccurate and said “we do plan to update the graphic to be more precise.” KFF didn’t advertise the correction and edited the graphic without publicly disclosing its error.

KFF’s own work demonstrates that the federal government will still pay the vast majority of most enrollees’ premiums if the enhanced subsidies, first enacted under the Biden administration in 2021, end. Its analysis last July found that in 2024 the enhanced subsidies paid an average of 88% of enrollees’ overall premiums. Without them, the federal government would have paid an average of 78% of enrollees’ premiums last year. KFF hasn’t published a more recent analysis, but other groups have confirmed that federal dollars will continue to pay the lion’s share of most enrollees’ premiums if the enhanced subsidies expire.

Focusing solely on percentages also obscures the difference between absolute and relative increases in out-of-pocket enrollee spending. In many ways, the large projected cost increases in percentage terms reinforce the richness of the enhanced subsidy regime, under which nearly half of enrollees qualify for zero-dollar (free) benchmark coverage.

Most exchange enrollees will face moderate increases in out-of-pocket costs in dollar terms. KFF estimated that the average enrollee will pay $1,016 more per year, or $84.67 more per month. A separate study from the Urban Institute concluded that households with incomes below 250% of the poverty level—who receive the richest subsidies, and comprise roughly three-quarters of all exchange enrollees—will pay an average of $750 more a year, or $62.50 monthly.

In response to my request, the KFF researchers claimed they couldn’t quantify the financial effect on the median enrollee. But given the results from KFF and the Urban Institute, most households will likely face increases of $50 to $100 a month.

Some will face more-substantial costs if the enhanced subsidies expire. Whereas ObamaCare limited subsidy eligibility to households with incomes below four times the poverty level, the enhanced subsidies eliminated that cap. If the enhanced subsidies expire, the cap would return, and households with incomes just above it could face thousands of dollars in heightened costs. But even here, KFF data show that such households represent a mere 7% of enrollees. The Urban Institute estimated that the uninsured rate among this cohort would rise only modestly, because they “are more likely to pick up coverage from an employer” and “are more willing to pay the full premium.”

Reasonable people can disagree about the wisdom of a $50 to $100 monthly cost increase for households of modest means. But given the Congressional Budget Office’s estimate that 2.3 million exchange enrollees “improperly claimed” subsidies “via intentional overstatement of income” this year, allowing the “free” benchmark coverage provision to lapse—requiring households to pay something toward their health insurance—seems necessary to combat fraud.

The left’s apocalyptic rhetoric about the expiration of the enhanced subsidies belies that federal taxpayers will still subsidize three-quarters of enrollees’ premium costs.

KFF’s misleading claim about premiums’ doubling echoes the maxim of not letting a good crisis go to waste, even if one has to use deceptive rhetoric to overstate the supposed “crisis.” Taxpayers footing the bill for ObamaCare subsidies shouldn’t be fooled by the scaremongering of the welfare-industrial complex.

Mr. Jacobs is founder and CEO of Juniper Research Group, a consulting firm

https://www.wsj.com/opinion/obamacar...ve-it-6a7316d7
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Old 10-26-2025, 06:56 PM   #52
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You find out. Those numbers probably aren’t accurate anyways. Bribes let in 20 million illegals.
Thank you for another excellent example of the Dunning Kruger effect.
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Old 10-26-2025, 07:08 PM   #53
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Those subsidies cost the government a measly 35 billion a year. What’s the damn problem?
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Originally Posted by txdot-guy View Post
Try this article outlining the actual issue.

Those changes would... increase government healthcare spending by $662 billion over 10 years.

EDIT: In my original post I stated the amount as 350 billion over 10 years whereas the Reuters article says 662 billion over 10 years. Why the discrepancy, I couldn’t say.
Thank you for noticing and acknowledging the discrepancy.
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Old 10-26-2025, 07:15 PM   #54
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Thank you for another excellent example of the Dunning Kruger effect.
Are you going to respond to Lusty? Or is it thanks for nothing? Gristle style!

BAHAHAHA
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Old 10-26-2025, 07:22 PM   #55
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Don't need to. We already danced that dance in the other thread, when he and Oldman lost both empirically and polemically. Besides, I was talking to you
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Old 10-26-2025, 08:03 PM   #56
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Default Evasion Is My Middle Name

Quote:
Originally Posted by HDGristle View Post
Don't need to. We already danced that dance in the other thread, when he and Oldman lost both empirically and polemically. Besides, I was talking to you
Translation - I can't deal with anyone who exposes the lies and deceit behind the Schumer shutdown, so I'll just pretend they already "lost" the argument in another, unnamed thread.

Soooo predictable!

BAAAHAHAHAHAHA!!
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Old 10-26-2025, 08:09 PM   #57
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Originally Posted by HDGristle View Post
Don't need to. We already danced that dance in the other thread, when he and Oldman lost both empirically and polemically. Besides, I was talking to you
And I was talking to you. And you bailed. No suprise.
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Old 10-26-2025, 08:23 PM   #58
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lustylad View Post
Did they forget to mention the fact that the enhanced ACA subsidies were passed entirely by Dems (in 2021-22 when they controlled both Houses of Congress) as an "emergency" covid-relief measure?

Did they neglect to mention how they (the Dems) voted for them to expire at end-2025? Now they've shut down the Government because... (wait for it... drumroll...) ...they've changed their minds?

Did they forget to tell you the original ACA subsidies will remain intact even after the expiration of the enhanced subsidies?

Did they forget to mention the enhanced subsidies are ridiculously generous - available even for people with annual incomes up to $600,000?

Why would they NOT tell you everything? As Paul Harvey would say, "Here is the REST OF THE STORY"!


https://www.cato.org/blog/six-reason...care-subsidies


At the center of the government shutdown is a disagreement over whether to extend a temporary pandemic-era expansion of the Affordable Care Act’s premium tax credits. These subsidies cover health insurance premiums for the roughly 7 percent of Americans who use the government-run Obamacare insurance marketplace. Sold as a temporary boost during the COVID-19 pandemic, the subsidies are costly, fraud-prone, and primarily pad insurance companies’ profits.

While the pandemic plus-up expires at the end of 2025, the originally designed Obamacare subsidy is permanent. The temporary expansion, enacted under the American Rescue Plan Act and later extended by the Inflation Reduction Act, increased the size and made the subsidies more widely available.

Here are six reasons Congress should not extend the inflated pandemic insurance subsidies:

1. Costs Almost Half a Trillion Dollars.

2. Funds the Well-Off.

3. Subsidizes Insurance Companies, not Patients.

4. Rampant Enrollment Fraud.

5. High Cost for Little Patient Value.

6. Temporary Emergencies Should Not Justify Permanent Entitlements.


(Click on the link for details of each of the above 6 points.)


Conclusion:

Biden’s pandemic-era Obamacare premium subsidies were sold as temporary relief but have instead produced fraud, phantom enrollees, and subsidies for wealthy taxpayers who don’t need them. The program funnels billions of taxpayer dollars to insurers and middlemen while distorting the individual market and doing little to expand meaningful access to care.
There are ways to fix many of these issues but not coming to the table makes the Republicans look like the cold hearted bastards they appear to be.

It’s still a better choice to extend the subsidies until 2028. Democrats are only doing this because it’s the only lever they have left to get Republicans to negotiate on anything.
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Old 10-26-2025, 08:26 PM   #59
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Originally Posted by lustylad View Post
Translation - I can't deal with anyone who exposes the lies and deceit behind the Schumer shutdown, so I'll just pretend they already "lost" the argument in another, unnamed thread.

Soooo predictable!

BAAAHAHAHAHAHA!!
Eye's shutdown thread, since you mentioned it. Pepperidge Farms remembers
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Old 10-26-2025, 08:31 PM   #60
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Originally Posted by txdot-guy View Post
There are ways to fix many of these issues but not coming to the table makes the Republicans look like the cold hearted bastards they appear to be.

It’s still a better choice to extend the subsidies until 2028. Democrats are only doing this because it’s the only lever they have left to get Republicans to negotiate on anything.
They passed a clean CR. The same one that the Democrats passed in March. End of story.
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