government shuts down

[1blackman1]

Originally Posted by Lantern2814

Maybe actually research something. It IS the left who is crying about giving free health care to illegals. If the truth pisses you off, that tells us all we need to know. And don't even start the tired, "illegals aren't eligible" crap. That doesn't mean anything. So in every case, people who aren't eligible for whatever the benefit is aren't getting those benefits?

By your logic, even if the rules were changed in the most strict manner possible, some illegal will find a way to get the benefit. Your only possible solution would be to eliminate any program from which any person could benefit,that way no illegal could possibly do so.

[69in2it69]

Originally Posted by 1blackman1

By your logic, even if the rules were changed in the most strict manner possible, some illegal will find a way to get the benefit. Your only possible solution would be to eliminate any program from which any person could benefit,that way no illegal could possibly do so.

And maybe some could research how much illegals have contributed to taxes, including SSI, of which they must contribute to, but cannot draw. Might have bought a few more years of Social Security if they'd left them alone, but I'm sure all the righties here are so wealthy they'll never need it.

[VitaMan]

Rolling Stone article is very clear what this issue is all about.

[texassapper]

Originally Posted by Lantern2814

And pathetically trying to blame Republicans for the Schumer Shutdown 2.0. Laughable.

he does what his masters in the Democrat Party tell him to do. That’s why he is making those laughable statements.

[Why_Yes_I_Do]

Bunch of window dressing. You'll see where immigration drives up GDP, but reduces productivity and wages. Not to mention, it requires more of Other Peoples Money (taxes) to sustain it all.
That's the shell game in a nutshell.

Americans Get More from Less Migration, Says Study by Pro-Migration Group

by Neil Munro 5 Oct 2025

Keeping migration low is the best way to raise Americans’ prosperity, says a study funded by the leading lobby group for investors who want mass migration.

“At medium and low immigration levels, labor-based [skilled professional] immigration, characterized by fewer but more skilled population, produces higher GDP [Gross Domestic Product] per capita [emphasis added] growth,” compared to mass inflow of migrants and their extended families, says the September study by Springer, titled “Demographic and Economic Implications of Alternative U.S. Immigration Policies.”

“That should be a no-brainer because we know we could annex Mexico and our GDP would be enormously higher, but our per capita income would drop,” said Rosemary Jenks, cofounder of the Immigration Accountability Project. “That’s just ‘Duh!'”

The study is useful because “you have the advocates [for mass migration] themselves saying immigration is not a good deal for the average American,” said Stephen Camarota, the research director at the Center for Immigration Studies. “It may be good for Wall Street, it’s not good for Main Street, ” he added.

The study matches reality in Canada, Australia, and the United Kingdom, where the estimated quality of life is declining and productivity is stalling because elites are importing consumers, renters, and workers to grow the nation’s real-estate prices and stock values.

FWD.us

The pro-migration report credits the education-fund spinoff of FWD.us for its creation, saying, “This research was supported by a grant from the FWD.us Education Fund.”

FWD.us was created by West Coast investors to lobby for a greater inflow of consumers, renters, and workers.

It was initially pushed by Facebook founder Mark Zuckerberg to pass the 2013 “Gang of Eight” amnesty bill. Since then, Zuckerberg has reportedly stepped back from the organization, ceding a greater role to other investor founders. The other leaders include venture capitalists Ron Conway and Reid Hoffman, and Salesforce founder Marc Benioff.

The group reveals very little about its funding or backers, or operations. But the report thanked the lobby group’s staff, including president Todd Schulte and advocacy chief Mark Delich:

The authors would like to thank Todd Schulte, Mark Delich, Phillip Connor, Pete Boorgard, Andrew Moriarity, Eddie Taveras, and two anonymous reviewers for their feedback on the manuscript at various stages. We also thank Giovanni Peri for his advice on modeling, and Tim O’Shea and Nowrin Fatema for research assistance.

The study looks at economic growth from 2021 to 2060, and concludes that GDP [the blue line] is maximized by mass immigration of families who must work to rent apartments and pay living expenses.

But per-capita income [the red line] is maximized by a smaller inflow of working-age, skilled workers, the FWD.us report admitted: “GDP grows faster in policy scenarios with higher immigration.”



The report’s scenarios consider unskilled mass migration — “family emphasis” — and skilled migration, dubbed “labor” migration. “Compared to the family emphasis scenarios, the labor-emphasis scenarios predict that immigration will be more concentrated in the prime working ages and include more Asian and European immigrants, and fewer Latin Americans,” the study adds.

The report concludes:

All family-emphasis scenarios experience slower GDP per capita growth compared to both their [skilled] labor counterparts and the zero immigration scenario, primarily due to larger population sizes and lower supplies of working-age populations.

In fact, the option of zero immigration generates higher per-capita growth than the GDP-boosting option of mass family migration, according to the study.

The report says the zero migration option grows per-capita income by 1.089 in the 35 years up to 2060.

Cutting immigration to half the 2021 level but emphasizing skilled migrants raises per capita result by 0.01.

Keeping migration at President Joe Biden’s 2021 rate but emphasizing skilled foreign workers raises per capita income by another 0.06, the study says:


...

[1blackman1]

Polls show the PEOPLE blame republicans and Trump by over 10 points.

Green is starting to say exactly what Dems are saying. Trump is hinting at folding by “fixing” healthcare.

Sounds like what I posted days ago would be the result.

[Why_Yes_I_Do]

On the brighter side of life:
Trump got 108 appointments approved during the shut down.

All gas! No Brakes!
Let's put the pedal to the metal now!

[texassapper]

Originally Posted by 1blackman1

Polls show the PEOPLE blame republicans and Trump by over 10 points.

lol

Poll shows blame spread across political spectrum for shutdown
67% say Republicans deserve plenty of blame; 63% say Democrats do as well

Meh, we'll take those numbers as long as we can start firing govt. work/welfare recipients

[Why_Yes_I_Do]

Originally Posted by texassapper

...Poll shows blame spread across political spectrum for shutdown
67% say Republicans deserve plenty of blame; 63% say Democrats do as well...

Here's a bigger picture that Karoline Leavitt shared

Oh! I meant this one...

[Eaton Beaver]

Originally Posted by Eaton Beaver

That they were supposed to sunset is not the point.

78 percent of the fucking electorate wants them to remain.

Congress is supposed to react to changing times.

And please, what is it with this "YOU" and "YOUR SIDE" bullshit? It just makes you look like you only care about pissing people off, not about making an actual point. And especially in this case, it isn't even accurate.

78 percent of people support these subsidies. Which means it is a fuck ton of people from "YOUR SIDE" also.

Originally Posted by Lantern2814

Maybe actually research something. It IS the left who is crying about giving free health care to illegals. If the truth pisses you off, that tells us all we need to know. And don't even start the tired, "illegals aren't eligible" crap. That doesn't mean anything. So in every case, people who aren't eligible for whatever the benefit is aren't getting those benefits?

I did research something. You just conveniently ignore it. Again.

But I stated it very clearly.

78 percent of people support the ACA subsidies. Including a bunch of people from "YOUR SIDE."

Meanwhile, I said absolutely fucking zero about giving "free health care to illegals." Nothing. Including nothing about "illegals aren't eligible crap." But you are so desperate to criticize me that you once again employ the tiresome MAGA tactic of putting words in people's mouths. Just make shit up.

Please continue! It helps prove the bias and flawed logic of virtually everything that you post.

[Precious_b]

Originally Posted by Salty Again

... All yer low-brow insults to me aside - you're NOT
being honest with this.

We're all aware that the Dems want the reimbursement money.
Newsom wants it for his Medi-Cal... And we keep hearing
from the lot of liberals that some o' the Big blue states
can fund themselves - Schumer Shut-down or no - but the
other blue states can't. ... Crikey! California could
barely survive after the wildfires - good thing that
President Trump was there to offour help.

So, President Trump is right - the Dems want money for
health care for Illegals - reimbursement money or even
direct payment if the Congress approves.

And THAT is why the Dems are holding out.
They didn't get their way.

#### Salty

Well NaCl-y, show us where specifically it says they are giving $$$ over.

Originally Posted by Eaton Beaver

Once again, it is ALSO THE FUCKING AFFORDABLE CARE ACT SUBSIDIES.

More people care about that, believe me. Like 78 percent of voters. Probably a lot of people you know and care about.

Alot of maggies care about it.

Originally Posted by Jacuzzme

It hasn’t been very long, but life for 99% of the population hasn’t changed a bit since the government has “shut down”. If it wasn’t for the media playing it up nobody would even know it happened. It’s a dangerous precedent for the bureaucracy when such panic has no effect whatsoever on people’s lives. Whatever agencies or workers have been displaced, I say leave them that way.

Really? Not that I was wanting to go off topic about other things, but did you consult the soybean farmers and such about that?

Originally Posted by 1blackman1

As usual. You’re still wrong. And fail to understand. Maybe I’ll try another language next time.

You know, having grown up in a Commonwealth country, I struggle at times trying to understand what he says. Worse than trying to follow the dialogue on an old episode of Coronation Street.

Originally Posted by farmstud60

You don't know dogs then

Well, you seem to know such than, why don't you address what Jacu stated about the farmers and such.

Originally Posted by farmstud60

There is still time to negotiate that if Democrats would pass the clean CR bill that is before them.

Really? Y'all maggies have had near 2 decades to implement your "concept of a plan". Don't be all butthurt that you got called out on it.

Originally Posted by Eaton Beaver

Please pay attention. I already posted about that:



Dem leaders in Congress might be dumb, but they aren't dumb enough to fall for that bullshit.

No shit.

Originally Posted by VitaMan

This article from Rolling Stone seems to contradict everything Salty and the usual MAGA Republicans are spewing:


House Speaker Mike Johnson continued to blame Democrats for the government shutdown, using misleading Republican talking points that insist that Democratic leadership is pushing to fund health care for undocumented immigrants.


Johnson said Sunday on CBS's Face the Nation that Democrats "want to spend $1.5 trillion, and they want to return hard-working taxpayer dollars to fund health care for illegal aliens. It is in their bill. Go to speaker.gov and see it for yourself. Page 57, Section 2141. They're using this for political games, and it is shameful, and real people are getting hurt."


"I have looked at that text," host Margaret Brennan replied. "It doesn't explicitly say what you are indicating."


As the shut down over these issues approaches its second week, according to a Washington Post poll, nearly half of Americans blame Trump and the Republicans for the government shut down - with 47 percent blaming the GOP and president - while less than a third (30 percent) believe congressional Democrats are responsible for it.






We went to the Speaker's site, which links to the Democratic proposal. The specific section Johnson mentioned - section 2141 on page 57 - repeals the changes to Medicaid made by Trump and the Republicans' One Big Beautiful Bill Act (OBBBA), which Johnson admitted.


"It's a compelling talking point to say that Democrats want to provide health care to undocumented immigrants, but it's just not true in terms of the cuts they're trying to reverse," Larry Levitt, executive vice president for health policy at KFF, a nonprofit and nonpartisan health policy information organization, told the Associated Press.




It's important to note that undocumented immigrants broadly do not qualify for Medicaid, Affordable Care Act subsidies, or other federally-funded health care coverage.


"Undocumented immigrants are not eligible for federally-funded health coverage," Drishti Pillai, director of Immigrant Health Policy at KFF, wrote. "The GOP's Big Beautiful Bill didn't change that. Overturning the health care provisions in the law won't either."


Further, under the OBBBA, many lawfully present immigrants who are eligible for Medicaid - such as asylum seekers, refugees, and survivors of human trafficking - will be rendered ineligible for the program in 2026 thanks to a section of the law titled "Alien Medicaid eligibility." If that provision stays in place, then next year, approximately 1.4 million immigrants lawfully in the U.S. will lose health coverage because Republicans severely restricted access to lawful permanent residents, Cuban and Haitian immigrants, and citizens of the Marshall Islands, Micronesia, and Palau. Democrats are pressing to reverse that.


Johnson also claimed on NBC's Meet the Press: "What the Democrats are demanding is that illegal aliens that care for them in an emergency room should be reimbursed at a higher rate."






Hospitals may be reimbursed for emergency room care given to undocumented immigrants due to a Reagan-era law (the Emergency Medical Treatment and Labor Act) that requires emergency rooms provide screening exams and stabilization care to everyone who comes through their doors seeking care, regardless of immigration status. Under the OBBBA, those reimbursements will decrease. Hospitals would still be obligated to deliver care to everyone, but they will not receive the same amount as they would have before OBBBA, also known as H.R. 1.




"H.R. 1 reduces the federal matching funds for states for some of this emergency care," explained Leonardo Cuello, research professor at Georgetown University's McCourt School of Public Policy's Center for Children and Families. "This provision does not actually change coverage for immigrants, and indeed the CBO scored it as having no impact on coverage, because hospitals must still provide the health care, and states must still pay them for the health care, it's just that the federal government will pay a smaller share of the cost. In other words, it's just a cut to federal funding for states to reimburse providers furnishing emergency services (which is still required)."


Democrats are also insisting on extending federal subsidies for people who purchase coverage through the ACA marketplace. If Republicans get their way, and those subsidies are lost, then ACA premiums could more than double. An estimated 10 million Americans, according to the nonpartisan Congressional Budget Office, could lose their health insurance between the GOP's Medicaid cuts and the loss of subsidies.

What you got to say about that NaCl-y? Da Lady said House Speaker is lying. And she stated anyone who can read the official script knows that his lips are not speaking the truth.

Originally Posted by Jacuzzme

The government needs to not only gtfo of health insurance but also healthcare delivery. Their involvement in both is why costs are so exorbitant. There’s no reason a young, healthy person should not be able to by a high deductible catastrophic plan for $50 a month or so. Insurance companies would love to write those policies but can’t because big brother mandates a bunch of stupid, unnecessary coverage.

This was a thing back in the day. Employers could offer “major medical” for their employees for a reasonable price. When you took a kid to the doctor with an ear infection or whatnot, he checked it out, wrote a script and you paid for the office visit yourself. If he/she/you wiped out on a bike and broke a couple bones or got some other big, expensive concern the coverage kicked in. Today’s plans are like car insurance that covers tires, brakes and oil changes. Of course the prices are ridiculous, they have to be or the insurers would go out of business.

That would be nice but those fat bastards on the Hill are addicted to the Health Care Plans their offices provide off the $$$$ of the tax payers.

Originally Posted by lustylad

From the 2019 Democrat Presidential debates:

Man! Just when it was gonna get good, the video stopped.
But like y'all maggies, you only look at black and white. You just can't operate in the grey.

Originally Posted by 1blackman1

Is 2019 2025? Thought not. Just because they wanted that to be the case back then and some may still want it to be case in 2025, the law says something different, as I’ve point out numerous times.

Only a fool would conflate the two and think they made some grand point. Or a liar. And we know what I think about you and what you put in your posts.

You used to at least post sensical arguments. Now you’re no better than Salty.

Yupper. I would love for them to quote where it is written they get all this $$$ for immigrant health care. They tend to exercise selective amnesia in how much $$$$$$$$$ these illegals put in the system with no hope of getting any returns on via taxes.