explain the difference

[nevergaveitathought]

we wont call for nor enforce a no-fly zone over ukraine for fear of a conflict, nuclear or otherwise, with russia

what is the difference with taiwan?

if we were to help taiwan and stand up to the ccp, should the communists attack taiwan

isnt that a direct conflict with the ccp and risking a nuclear conflict?

what exactly is the difference with taiwan as compared to ukraine?

one, we might have a self defense agreement with, while with the other we dont

but to help taiwan we'd have to risk what we arent willing to risk with ukraine

what will we really do for taiwan?

are we chickenshits?

is china learning we are chickenshits?

[nevergaveitathought]

"Russia's invasion of Ukraine - and the reluctance of Western countries to send troops to defend it - has raised worries in Taiwan that Beijing might be emboldened to try a similar move. The catchphrase "Today Ukraine, Tomorrow Taiwan," has circulated uneasily across the island."

[Precious_b]

Difference: Ukraine is a recognized independent country. Taiwan is, by China, considered a rogue province and is treated differently with the USA since Eisenhauer told Chang Kai Shek (sp) that we weren't going to fight a ground war there and that policy has held.

[nevergaveitathought]

well what you typed is a topsy turvy of our supposed policy

[Precious_b]

What I typed is in reference to this: The U.S. State Department's official position in 1959 was:

That the provisional capital of the Republic of China has been at Taipei, Taiwan (Formosa) since December 1949; that the Government of the Republic of China exercises authority over the island; that the sovereignty of Formosa has not been transferred to China; and that Formosa is not a part of China as a country, at least not as yet, and not until and unless appropriate treaties are hereafter entered into. Formosa may be said to be a territory or an area occupied and administered by the Government of the Republic of China, but is not officially recognized as being a part of the Republic of China.

— U.S. State Department, 1959

[HedonistForever]

We would do exactly what we are doing with Ukraine, supply weapons that China might very well see as an act of war but we will do nothing else and both Russia and China now know this, they can essentially take what they want.

[Precious_b]

I wonder if some people are having second thoughts about not including Ukraine to NATO.

[Jackie S]

Originally Posted by Precious_b

I wonder if some people are having second thoughts about not including Ukraine to NATO.

We would be in World War 3 if Ukraine was indeed part of NATO.

That is, if the Western Democracies would actually honor the NATO Charter and defend a member that was being attacked.

But since all Putin would have to do is threaten to unleash his Nukes, we would be in the same situation as now.

In short, being a member of NATO and $5.50 will get you a cup of coffee at Starbucks.

[Precious_b]

If they were already in NATO, that changes the pieces before the game began.

Seeing they are weren't allowed to ally, there was mp entangling alliance Russia had to worry about.

[bambino]

https://t.me/sharirayepatriots/25667

[Why_Yes_I_Do]

Originally Posted by nevergaveitathought

...what exactly is the difference with taiwan as compared to ukraine?...

In a word? Pretty much our entire economy. Remember that "chip" shortage? TWK (I think) pointed out that Taiwan is supplier for about 85% of our chips. Not that that was the problem this go around. Plus how much other stuff did we off-shore to Taiwan?

[Why_Yes_I_Do]

Originally Posted by Precious_b

If they were already in NATO, that changes the pieces before the game began...

And they were not, so it didn't.

[eddieg5212]

Having never really launched nuclear weapons other than on those Japanese who deserved them we need practice. If we some how found our balls and made Russia a pile of aches I suspect China would get into the "kiss USA ass line". Like most of Russia's shit doubt if their nukes work.

[the_real_Barleycorn]

I was going to start by saying that Taiwan is only about 100 miles off the coast of China. I wanted to get the exact distance and the internet kept telling me that they were a thousand miles apart. Not sure what that means but at least three different sites agreed. Strange.
Anyway, putting up a no-fly zone requires air superiority which would be difficult for a country 4,000 miles away. Why should we?
Electronic chip production for the west is centered around Taiwan. Lose Taiwan and we lose the ability to mass produce cars, TVs, computers, weapons systems, medical equipment, etc. Of course, South Korea could step up but have you heard who their neighbor to the north is? We could fall back Japan to help out but their output is a fraction of South Korea and Taiwan. Japan is about the distance of the state of Texas from China. Nearly all of our electronic chip production is a stone's throw from the World's worst offender of human rights.
Now we have also made promises going back decades to Taiwan. China has been threatening the Philippines for years and they argue over the Spratley Islands. If Taiwan is abandoned, then PI is next. Vietnam would be on the menu.
We're going to have to come to terms with the fact that Russia is a European problem and China is an Asian problem. The United States can tip the scales on either front but it is going to have to be a combined effort of the world against two powerful nations on the march.

Next time we can talk about nuclear weapons, yields, and space.

[nevergaveitathought]

Originally Posted by eddieg5212

Having never really launched nuclear weapons other than on those Japanese who deserved them we need practice. If we some how found our balls and made Russia a pile of aches I suspect China would get into the "kiss USA ass line". Like most of Russia's shit doubt if their nukes work.

i agree

if we showed balls with russia then the taiwan issue would be safer

at least for another 20 years

you know china puts out an annual "state of china" sort of report each year and discusses issues like taiwan

this year the wording regarding taiwan was changed for the first time in quite a while

they dropped the "peaceful" reunification of taiwan