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A Question of Legality Post your legal questions here (general, nothing of a personal nature)

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Old 08-10-2019, 05:58 AM   #1
housekeydoor
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Default Planning a massager parlor visit for a BJ, what could go wrong?

Title says it, I need to get a real good BJ session and there apparently is a massage place in my area that has been recommended.

Prudence dictates caution, so I'm gathering intelligence before doing anything. In this case, the issue is "what can go wrong"?

I'm not talking about getting ripped off at the place, or herpes or something like that. I'm concerned that with my luck, the local fuzz would be planning a sting on the place just as I walk in.

And if there were any L.E. contact, what to do, what's the likely result, like a ticket or fine or whatever?

I don't want ANYONE finding out about this possible adventure. I've already considered some factors, like parking the car a distance away, shutting off the cell phone and blocking it from signals, not taking any ID or unneeded items into the massage parlor with me, just some cash and a way to re-enter the car afterwards. Nothing else.

Tips? Ideas? Suggestions? Thanks.
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Old 08-10-2019, 08:44 AM   #2
Chung Tran
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Quote:
Originally Posted by housekeydoor View Post
Title says it, I need to get a real good BJ session and there apparently is a massage place in my area that has been recommended.

Prudence dictates caution, so I'm gathering intelligence before doing anything. In this case, the issue is "what can go wrong"?

I'm not talking about getting ripped off at the place, or herpes or something like that. I'm concerned that with my luck, the local fuzz would be planning a sting on the place just as I walk in.

And if there were any L.E. contact, what to do, what's the likely result, like a ticket or fine or whatever?

I don't want ANYONE finding out about this possible adventure. I've already considered some factors, like parking the car a distance away, shutting off the cell phone and blocking it from signals, not taking any ID or unneeded items into the massage parlor with me, just some cash and a way to re-enter the car afterwards. Nothing else.

Tips? Ideas? Suggestions? Thanks.
suggestion... stay home and jack off.. it's cheaper, faster, and you won't be worried about a Boogie Man. you have no business seeking a Spa BBBJ under your condition.
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Old 08-10-2019, 09:12 AM   #3
DNinja69
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Default And there you have it...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chung Tran View Post
suggestion... stay home and jack off.. it's cheaper, faster, and you won't be worried about a Boogie Man. you have no business seeking a Spa BBBJ under your condition.
Always use caution and keep your eyes open for signs of trouble going into any hobby venue. But if you got a list like that will you be able to relax and enjoy yourself?

One good practice is to travel for hobby time. If you live in a bigger city hit a neighborhood off the path. In a smaller town it may be difficult, but thats also more reason to make the drive and not be close to home for fun time.

Pick a spot in a strip mall where you can park then walk into some other shop and work your way down to the massage place.

And as always use Eccie for research to make sure the place
you are going to visit has a good track record.
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Old 08-12-2019, 09:26 AM   #4
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I disagree with Chung on this. I've got all of the same concerns that you list, and I've enjoyed many sessions in Dallas AMPs.

I think you've touched on some of the things you can do. Beyond that, I only have a few comments:

1. Never discuss or negotiate terms. Make sure you know how things work and make sure you arrange for there to be no discussion of terms. If that means leaving money out where it's visible or convincing her that you'll take care of her, do it. Do NOT discuss money for sex. Period.

2. If the spa/parlor is being targeted like the Kraft spa, then there's nothing you can do, so don't stress over it.

3. If lightning strikes, statistically speaking, and the police raid the parlor while you're there, be polite and honest, but don't volunteer more information than necessary. You're there for a relaxing massage, right? Nothing wrong with that... Not sure about your experience, but there's a line between "cooperate and hope they leave you alone" and "lawyer up and don't say anything." Think logically (not emotionally) about where that line is for you. Keeping your mouth shut may ensure you don't get convicted, but might increase the odds of handcuffs and a ride downtown. Cooperating might increase the odds of them leaving you alone, but if the odds go against you, your words may make it easier for them to convict if you develop verbal diarrhea. Remember to not ever lie. If they do have a Kraftonian camera, and you lie about what happened, then you've committed ANOTHER crime. Better to be silent than lie. "No offense, officer, but I don't feel comfortable talking about this with you."
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Old 08-12-2019, 01:55 PM   #5
sketchball82
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Crock View Post
Nothing wrong with that... Not sure about your experience, but there's a line between "cooperate and hope they leave you alone" and "lawyer up and don't say anything." Think logically (not emotionally) about where that line is for you. Keeping your mouth shut may ensure you don't get convicted, but might increase the odds of handcuffs and a ride downtown.
I do not recommend this approach. Lawyers do not just protect you from conviction. That is obviously our most important function, but we also protect you from embarrassment, harassment, and other things.

I disagree that cooperating will help. If the cop has PC to arrest you, he will arrest you. If he doesn't have PC, you get to wave bubye and walk away. There is no test here for if the cop likes you.

If you shut up, he can only get PC from collected evidence from others, physical evidence, and implied facts.

If you talk, all you're doing is giving him more evidence. You assume it will be favorable, but that is assuming:
- he hears you correctly,
- someone else doesn't contradict you,
- he remembers what you said correctly,
- you dont get flustered and say something wrong,
- you remember the facts/story correctly,
- you dont innocently admit to another crime,
- he's honest about what you said,
- etc.

What you say is NOT hearsay. It is technical nonhearsay because you'd be a non-party opponent at a trial. That means the gov't CAN and WILL bring up non-favorable interviews at trial, and your lawyer probably wont be able to stop it. All you had to do was shut up.

Simply put, talking WILL NOT HELP YOU. I dont know how many times we have to repeat this before people quit telling the lawyers we're wrong about the law. SHUT THE FUCK UP.

Crock's logic assumes that cops will vindictively arrest you for not cooperating or let you go if they like you.

Regarding vindictiveness, they cant. That's what burden of proof means. It's his burden, and if he arrests you vindictively without the proper burden being met, you can sue him under a Bivens or §1983 action.

Regarding letting you go because he likes you, this is more reasonable but still highly unlikely. First of all, this one is a crime, not a traffic citation. That means it isn't the cop's call. It is a prosecutor's. The cop can choose not to arrest you, but that wont stop the prosecutor from investigating you or saying "go arrest him" ten minutqes later.

Please listen to the lawyers.

Shut the fuck up.

* END RANT
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Old 08-12-2019, 07:31 PM   #6
aznlvr11
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^^^ this
cops will lie to get a bust. you may get a dismissal down the road, but they can still make your life miserable in the mean time. chances are they are after the women anyway.
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Old 08-14-2019, 11:28 AM   #7
ShysterJon
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Sticking with the OP's question, I'd suggest he buddy up with a long-term, well-established hobbyist on Eccie that writes good reviews.

But I can't leave the following unchallenged.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Crock View Post
If lightning strikes, statistically speaking, and the police raid the parlor while you're there, be polite and honest, but don't volunteer more information than necessary. You're there for a relaxing massage, right? Nothing wrong with that... Not sure about your experience, but there's a line between "cooperate and hope they leave you alone" and "lawyer up and don't say anything." Think logically (not emotionally) about where that line is for you. Keeping your mouth shut may ensure you don't get convicted, but might increase the odds of handcuffs and a ride downtown. Cooperating might increase the odds of them leaving you alone, but if the odds go against you, your words may make it easier for them to convict if you develop verbal diarrhea. Remember to not ever lie. If they do have a Kraftonian camera, and you lie about what happened, then you've committed ANOTHER crime. Better to be silent than lie. "No offense, officer, but I don't feel comfortable talking about this with you."
I think this is hideously bad advice. If you think talking to the cops might help you, you're a fool and you obviously have never had contact with LE. You are merely an arrest waiting to happen. My advice is to SAY NOTHING. You don't need a lawyer to do that. Say something like, "I'd really like to help you, officer. But I've got this bastard of a lawyer who tells me I should say nothing."
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Old 08-15-2019, 01:22 AM   #8
Masada45
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sketchball82 View Post
I do not recommend this approach. Lawyers do not just protect you from conviction. That is obviously our most important function, but we also protect you from embarrassment, harassment, and other things.

I disagree that cooperating will help. If the cop has PC to arrest you, he will arrest you. If he doesn't have PC, you get to wave bubye and walk away. There is no test here for if the cop likes you.

If you shut up, he can only get PC from collected evidence from others, physical evidence, and implied facts.

If you talk, all you're doing is giving him more evidence. You assume it will be favorable, but that is assuming:
- he hears you correctly,
- someone else doesn't contradict you,
- he remembers what you said correctly,
- you dont get flustered and say something wrong,
- you remember the facts/story correctly,
- you dont innocently admit to another crime,
- he's honest about what you said,
- etc.

What you say is NOT hearsay. It is technical nonhearsay because you'd be a non-party opponent at a trial. That means the gov't CAN and WILL bring up non-favorable interviews at trial, and your lawyer probably wont be able to stop it. All you had to do was shut up.

Simply put, talking WILL NOT HELP YOU. I dont know how many times we have to repeat this before people quit telling the lawyers we're wrong about the law. SHUT THE FUCK UP.

Crock's logic assumes that cops will vindictively arrest you for not cooperating or let you go if they like you.

Regarding vindictiveness, they cant. That's what burden of proof means. It's his burden, and if he arrests you vindictively without the proper burden being met, you can sue him under a Bivens or §1983 action.

Regarding letting you go because he likes you, this is more reasonable but still highly unlikely. First of all, this one is a crime, not a traffic citation. That means it isn't the cop's call. It is a prosecutor's. The cop can choose not to arrest you, but that wont stop the prosecutor from investigating you or saying "go arrest him" ten minutqes later.

Please listen to the lawyers.

Shut the fuck up.

* END RANT
Thank you for that. It's exactly what I and many other leaglly-inept people needed to hear. Great advice. I will use this in the future.
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Old 08-15-2019, 10:21 PM   #9
housekeydoor
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The above responses made me think of one more thing. What to say and what not to say to the women when I get in the building, then in the massage room.

For example, I want an awesome blowjob that'll have me blasting a condom full of cum in 5 minutes or less. That's all I want. No massage, no sex, nothing shoved up my ass, etc.

What's the preferred way of communicating this to whatever woman I end up in the room with?

From the reviews I have read so far, Kyoto seems to be the place to go to, but not everyone filled out their review specifying just BJs.
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Old 08-20-2019, 12:09 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sketchball82 View Post
I disagree that cooperating will help. If the cop has PC to arrest you, he will arrest you. If he doesn't have PC, you get to wave bubye and walk away.
The problem with this, of course, is that there's more than one statute that a cop can use to arrest someone. Just because there's no PC for the charge of prostitution, does not mean there isn't PC for manifestation, or fail to ID, or violating a municipal cruising law.

It's been posited that it's impossible for the average person to go an entire day without breaking a law.


Quote:
Originally Posted by ShysterJon View Post
I think this is hideously bad advice. If you think talking to the cops might help you, you're a fool and you obviously have never had contact with LE. You are merely an arrest waiting to happen. My advice is to SAY NOTHING. You don't need a lawyer to do that. Say something like, "I'd really like to help you, officer. But I've got this bastard of a lawyer who tells me I should say nothing."
Hmmm, I think I chose some of my words very poorly.

I certainly didn't mean to advise anyone to cooperate (and, re-reading it, that's not at all what I said). I pointed out that there's a line between cooperating, and not saying a word. You give a great example of something that is between those two options.

You might think you actually suggested the "lawyer up and say nothing" option, but others think it actually means to literally not say a word. I believe that impolite silence invites further investigation. Further, there are laws in many places, that require one to identify themselves to police during an investigation. Refusing can result in arrest. I think that literally saying nothing is a bad idea unless you think it's a foregone conclusion that you're going to be arrested. But I'm not a practicing attorney.
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Old 08-22-2019, 12:02 PM   #11
ShysterJon
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Crock wrote: "Just because there's no PC for the charge of prostitution, does not mean there isn't PC for manifestation, or fail to ID, or violating a municipal cruising law." Crock also wrote: "Further, there are laws in many places, that require one to identify themselves to police during an investigation. Refusing can result in arrest."

In Texas, a person violates the law if they fail to identify themselves IF THEY ARE ARRESTED or IF THEY ARE DRIVING. Put another way, unless you've been arrested or you're operating a motor vehicle, you're not required to identify yourself. See:

Texas Penal Code 38.02 -- Failure to Identify
.

If a cop intends to issue a manifestation citation and the suspect fails to VOLUNTARILY reveal their identity, the officer can either release the suspect or arrest them (and yes, in Texas a person can be arrested on suspicion of having committed a Class C misdemeanor). My rough estimate is silence leads to one arrest for every 20 releases.

btw, I have no idea what you mean by a "municipal cruising law." To my knowledge, there's no such thing.

Crock wrote: "I believe that impolite silence invites further investigation." WTF is the FACTUAL basis for your assertion? Chances are you won't hurt Barney Fife's feelings by not talking to him. Note: Watching cop shows on TV or cop movies gives a person no credit toward a law degree. On the other hand, my long experience as a lawyer tells me silence tends to end any possible investigation for many minor offenses. A cop met with silence will move on to fish that are easier to catch (like Crock, I think - haha). Chances are you won't hurt Barney Fife's feelings by not talking to him. I will AGAIN state that, unless you're a lawyer, please don't render legal advice. If a hobbyist wrote a fake review speculating how playing with a provider might be, we'd all laugh him out of this place. The same is true with legal advice by a layperson (and by layperson, I don't mean a provider - haha).
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Old 08-22-2019, 12:44 PM   #12
Unique_Carpenter
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Jon,
Thank you.

For everyone, there's two and only two basic rules and one preamble.
Preamble: screen the date
Rule 1: Stfu
Rule 2: Leave the advise to the attorneys.

Last, I wish the old sticky's were still stuck, as the same qs show up over and over.
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Old 08-23-2019, 07:37 AM   #13
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One way to keep from getting busted while you are at an establishment is to NOT name a certain place and what they do, in a forum that is accessible to anyone that just signs up.
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Old 08-23-2019, 08:55 AM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by luvlittlemilkers View Post
One way to keep from getting busted while you are at an establishment is to NOT name a certain place and what they do, in a forum that is accessible to anyone that just signs up.

I don't review spa's. They are easy targets, if we give LE info on which ones are giving us a HE.


I don't frequent them, but when in a city or town with an Asian spa and ZERO well reviewed providers, I will find one, go in and get a massage.



Probably 75% of the spa's I visit end up giving me an HE with hands, mouth and sometimes FS.

You just have to be nice and work their system. Don't go in asking for an HE.
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Old 08-23-2019, 09:33 AM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by housekeydoor View Post
.

For example, I want an awesome blowjob that'll have me blasting a condom full of cum in 5 minutes or less. That's all I want. No massage, no sex, nothing shoved up my ass, etc.

What's the preferred way of communicating this to whatever woman I end up in the room with?


It is better to let them work on you a bit and get comfortable with you. book a 30min rather than one hour. You have to come on slowly or it will likely make them suspicious of you. Basic body language is the way to ask. As she is working on you, touch her legs. turn over before she asks you to. Point to it, after she touches it point to her mouth. (assuming they don't speak English). I have had them whisper into my ear, but mostly they do whatever bonus material based on trust that they will get a good tip. I assure you they will remember you good or bad. So if you fall short on the first visit, you should be good on the next, plus can directly ask for what you want.

If you hit that 1/10000 odds of bad timing and the cops show when you are there, Sergeant Schultz has basically taught you everything you need yo know.
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