Oh gawd please stop with the bathroom mirror pics!

[hookem69horns]

In the end, all I really want is to know the pics are an accurate depiction of the provider. Period.

When they get photoshopped to hell and look so very different than a cell camera, then I always use the most natural looking photo, in her Showcase, to evaluate her for a potential session.

[LynnT]

Originally Posted by PODarkness

I've never understood what some providers have against photographers who are open to barter. If a girl wants to pay cash she can. If being a provider automatically means she can afford to pay cash (an assumption I'm not willing to make) then she won't need that option. I see no coercion in the OP's post to make a girl trade if she would rather pay cash or to even influence her choice of how to pay, other than to say he's open to discussing the option. I get the impression reading your post that the quality of the OP's photos became moot the moment he said he is willing to discuss trading services. I do not understand that.

Why does offering barter as an option mean the photographer must have an agenda, and what evil agenda does it mean he has?

What if someone wants to pay cash and they decide they don't like the pics? They don't pay for them. I don't see how barter would be any different. The provider doesn't want a photo shoot, she wants photos. Don't make the trade until the photographer has something to trade with.

I see posts all the time by providers who need this or that and say they are willing to trade for it. Why is it such a peeve for a guy to say he is open to discussing the option for his services, when it is obviously OK for a provider to say it? Why the double standard?

What am I missing?


POD

I think his post and dissing the ladies would make one wonder his agenda. I would say most professionals wouldn't post to get business the way he did. Even if they were looking to trade. Also ladies here/in this biz just deal with sooo many GWC's so you become leery. He didnt even post any of his work, seems shady IMO. He did later in the thread.

Im personally for the barter system.

[Iaintliein]

Originally Posted by PODarkness

Nice.
I don't think we've met, but you are calling me dumb, and making assumptions about me that are baseless, and less than flattering.

POD

On the contrary, I was using sarcasm to point out the silliness that photographers "only want to see girls naked" as others had stated. Believe me, I meant no disrespect to your position and I apologize for leaving that impression.
Regards,

[LynnT]

I cant believe the amount of people that think cell pictures look more "real".. Hello, you can photoshop a cell image!! I can go in PS and take my head and put it on a new body in a cell image.. Hell I have PS app on my iPhone.. What detail do they show?? They are usually distorted, blurred, or filled noise.. come on people..

Pro images not PSed to death will SHOW WAY MORE DETAIL AND REALNESS that a cell image ever would! I dont care what kind of phone you have.. I think it makes a lady just look cheap using all cell images IMO.

Regardless, if you're a professional you should have professional images, cell shots are not I dont care how good you "look" in that mirror. Do some marketing research. You want a better class of men and make more money go all pro. Test the theory.

[PhotoFantasies]

As a professional photographer who has shot with a lot of providers, I feel like I need to put in MY 2 cents worth.. (because that's about all it's worth) and I have no intention of trying to hijack this thread.. just weighing in with my opinion..

I actually think BOTH kinds of photos have their place on here. I really think your avatar image should be HOT.. that's what draws people in and makes them click on your page. that shot literally is THE most important shot you have.. There are a lot of providers here in the Dallas area, and a lot of competition for your business. Getting men to check out your page is important, and I think a professional shot that is well done and grabs the eye is SO important. Once they are on your page then cell phone shots have their place. I am not just a photographer, but also a hobbiest, and I admit.. I like to see BOTH kinds of photos.. provided that your "mirror" shots are clear, sexy, and not only shows your looks but also your personality. Any photo should capture more than just your looks.. It should also be a window to your personality. To my hobby side that IS important. If you are going to do a cell phone shot, do it right.

My advice is that if nothing else, talk to a professional and collaborate on an avatar shot that will grab attention, and not only reflect YOU and your personality, but also actually LOOK LIKE YOU! I have been doing more and more shoots with providers that focus on that ONE shot... the avatar, and and I recommend you consider a one shot custom avatar shoot. And you should work with the photographer to make sure it represents YOU and WHO you are. It doesn't have to be me.. there are many good photographers who advertise on here.. choose your favorite.

Like I said, MY opinion is only worth about 2 cents... your photos are worth THOUSANDS of dollars to your business. So whether you feel a cell phone shot or a professional shot is right for you.. make sure it is a shot that will draw guys in to explore your page further. I'll crawl back in my hole now!! LOL

[Robin3212003]

Originally Posted by PODarkness

First of all let me apologize. When I started writing my post your first post was at the end of the thread. I got side tracked by other things in the middle of writing it, then finished without seeing your second post.

My questions still stand. Why do so many providers consider offering an option to trade services bad or wrong or sleazy? Whatever the OP meant by trade, it seems from your first post, that this is your opinion of the practice. I don't understand that point of view for reasons I stated in my last post. Certainly you have no obligation to explain yourself to me, but I asked because I really don't get it and I have asked the question before without getting any answers.

I do photography as a hobby. I used to do it professionally, but found a career that pays better and has better perks. I sometimes do photo shoots for providers, and I enjoy it. As a hobby, I don't need to pay rent from

photography, but I found that unless I charge for the pics I get NCNS on the shoot 9 times out of ten, and it becomes more hassle than it's worth. I charge for the service, and the ladies seem to take it more seriously.
I offer the option of trading services, and I've found that it's about a 50/50 split on what any given provider will choose. I avoid drama by only collecting (money or services) after the lady has a disk of photos in her hand, and is happy with them. I make it clear that if they don't like the photos they have two options. Give back the disk and walk away no charge, or try again and pay me when they have pics they like. It's never happened, so I can't say if












doing it that way avoids drama, but I think it should.

I find it oddly contradictory for providers to be so prejudiced about bartering with photographers, when I see posts offering to barter for laptops, cars, loans, legal services, travel, etc. not to mention cash, and when half the providers I shoot actually choose barter over cash.

Can someone fill me in on what I'm doing that is sleazy, wrong, dishonest, offensive, distasteful, impolite, immoral, insensitive, unfeeling, cheap, fattening, or high in cholesterol?
I really don't see it.

You forgot to mention "creepy."

[PODarkness]

Originally Posted by hookem69horns

In the end, all I really want is to know the pics are an accurate depiction of the provider. Period.

When they get photoshopped to hell and look so very different than a cell camera, then I always use the most natural looking photo, in her Showcase, to evaluate her for a potential session.

Phone pics are actually easier to photoshop than high res pics. Without the detail it's easier to hide the changes. That said, people who's only camera is a cell phone probably don't own photoshop.

Originally Posted by LynnT

I think his post and dissing the ladies would make one wonder his agenda. I would say most professionals wouldn't post to get business the way he did. Even if they were looking to trade. Also ladies here/in this biz just deal with sooo many GWC's so you become leery. He didnt even post any of his work, seems shady IMO. He did later in the thread.

Im personally for the barter system.

I thought the same thing, not about an agenda so much, just his approach to advertising, but then, Lisa Lisa was attracted to his style, up to a point. WALDT?

I'm drawing a blank. What's GWC?

Originally Posted by Iaintliein

On the contrary, I was using sarcasm to point out the silliness that photographers "only want to see girls naked" as others had stated. Believe me, I meant no disrespect to your position and I apologize for leaving that impression.
Regards,

Scratching my head, because I don't see the sarcasm, but ok, if you say so.

Originally Posted by LynnT

I cant believe the amount of people that think cell pictures look more "real".. Hello, you can photoshop a cell image!! I can go in PS and take my head and put it on a new body in a cell image.. Hell I have PS app on my iPhone.. What detail do they show?? They are usually distorted, blurred, or filled noise.. come on people..

Pro images not PSed to death will SHOW WAY MORE DETAIL AND REALNESS that a cell image ever would! I dont care what kind of phone you have.. I think it makes a lady just look cheap using all cell images IMO.

Regardless, if you're a professional you should have professional images, cell shots are not I dont care how good you "look" in that mirror. Do some marketing research. You want a better class of men and make more money go all pro. Test the theory.

You hit the nail on the head. Cell phone pics can be hot, and any hot pic will bring business. That said, how you advertise, and the pics you use, are a reflection of how you want to be seen and thought of by potential customers. If you want to attract blue collar clients, you advertise one way. If you want blue blood clients, you do it another. Being a fairly blue collar guy myself, I'm glad there are providers that want blue collar clients, but I'm happy to help those who want to diversify.

Originally Posted by PhotoFantasies

I really think your avatar image should be HOT.. that's what draws people in and makes them click on your page. that shot literally is THE most important shot you have..

Very true, and avatar images require a whole different way of looking at composition and contrast. A great photo won't always be a great avatar.

Originally Posted by Robin3212003

You forgot to mention "creepy."

LOL. Yea, I've been coming up with new words to add ever since I posted that, but I have passed the window for editing it.

Originally Posted by Tony Gambino

why do any old guys with a half assed camera think they are piccaso?? ok dude your an artist lookin at at twenty something hookers....your picasso.......loser

I don't own a Picasso, and I didn't know Picasso did a painting called "loser", even though I'm pretty familiar with his work.

There's this one, and it seems to fit the thread, titled "girl before a mirror"


And this one, titled "Ignorant Italian"


I searched Google for "Loser", but didn't find anything by Picasso. Can you provide a link?

Ohh! You meant you're Picasso! I get it now.

[Colonel Jim]

Originally Posted by BustyCallieGirl

I just get tired of guys postings ad's for taking photos.......To me they all want to see everything for free.....Us girls can see guys out to do the photos..I think professional and also just plain photos are good..I had a bathroom camera one that I did years ago and people loved it..

If that is your experience, I am sorry. I am a dedicated amateur photographer who takes pride in my art. I have been doing quality photography for North Alabama escorts for close to six years, and was the "house photographer" for a local agency and was credited with increasing their business. Just because a photographer doesn't earn his/her living at photography doesn't mean they are not "professional". I can't make the kind of living I have doing photography full time, but it doesn't mean I can't put as much, or more, effort into my shoots than a photographer who does weddings and then escorts on the side. But what I can offer is lower-priced, quality photos for ladies starting out in the biz without a lot of cash because I don't have the overhead of a full-time studio.

As a hobbyist as well, I tell you that bathroom-mirror pix are a turn-off. All they say to me is "cheap" and are suspect. I have yet to see an upscale provider's website with a bathroom-mirror picture. They have been valuable, though, as leads to contact providers as potential photo clients.

There are quality amateur photographers out here. I'm not talking GWCs, but men/women who enjoy doing the work, and not just "to see everything for free".

[Colonel Jim]

Originally Posted by PODarkness

I'm drawing a blank. What's GWC?

GWC = Guy With a Camera. "Commonly used in the modeling/photographer biz, 'GWC' is any poser/creep with a digital camera pretending to be a pro/semi-pro photographer. With the introduction of digital cameras, GWC's have appeared like an explosion in a toy store." (Model Mayhem)

Unfortunately, the term has been used for any photographer who does not have a professional website, full-time studio, and hundreds of thousands of dollars in "professional" equipment, when it was originally used for a man who used photography strictly to get women to undress for him.

It's attitude, experience, and talent that make the difference, not equipment.

[HoustonWhiteKnight]

Veda Designs does high end websites for providers. Do those websites help the ladies make more money = absofuckinglutely yes

Do those ladies use cell phone pics.. fuck no

If you are a $150 girl then just keep on truckin with your cell pics.

If you have the desire to ever be a $300 or $500 girl.. get some damn photos done, get a website ( a real website ), and market yourself differently.

Not sure if you ladies realize this, but being a escort, hooker, provider, whatever you want to call it is all about marketing and promotion. Don't market and promote yourself and noone calls you. Market yourself with crappy pics and crappy clients call (not always, just sayin).
But get professional photos done, get a professional website done, get a professional banner done and advertise yourself as a top notch chick and you might just get some guys calling that never did in the past. New guys join this board each and every day that have never seen or heard of you before. Those are all potential new customers to you and if they see this kick ass website and some kick ass pics, they just might call and be willing to pay a kick ass rate! But if you keep the same free shitty website and the same shitty pictures, you'll get the same shitty rate from the same shitty clients.

What I can't stand is a "professional" photographer with a free wordpress site. If you can't afford a $12 domain name and $40 a year for hosting, WTF. And whats up with people that do pay for a real domain name like dumbshitphotoguy.com and then they use some generic email from yahoo or gmail. if you have a domain, get a real email address like douchebag@dumbshitphotoguy.com


Same goes for you girls. You charge more for your time than my attorney and you can't at least get a real website? WTF I wish those free escort sites would go away.

[HoustonWhiteKnight]

Oh and by the way.. a camera don't mean shit. Camera Bodies all basically do the same thing. The lens is what makes a photo. You can have a $300 camera body and pop a $2000 lens on it and take some bad ass photos. FYI

[Guest101114]

Originally Posted by LynnT

I cant believe the amount of people that think cell pictures look more "real".. Hello, you can photoshop a cell image!! I can go in PS and take my head and put it on a new body in a cell image.. Hell I have PS app on my iPhone.. What detail do they show?? They are usually distorted, blurred, or filled noise.. come on people..

Pro images not PSed to death will SHOW WAY MORE DETAIL AND REALNESS that a cell image ever would! I dont care what kind of phone you have.. I think it makes a lady just look cheap using all cell images IMO.

Regardless, if you're a professional you should have professional images, cell shots are not I dont care how good you "look" in that mirror. Do some marketing research. You want a better class of men and make more money go all pro. Test the theory.

Another OPINION

[LynnT]

Originally Posted by Colonel Jim

GWC = Guy With a Camera. "Commonly used in the modeling/photographer biz, 'GWC' is any poser/creep with a digital camera pretending to be a pro/semi-pro photographer. With the introduction of digital cameras, GWC's have appeared like an explosion in a toy store." (Model Mayhem)

Unfortunately, the term has been used for any photographer who does not have a professional website, full-time studio, and hundreds of thousands of dollars in "professional" equipment, when it was originally used for a man who used photography strictly to get women to undress for him.

It's attitude, experience, and talent that make the difference, not equipment.

Thanks for answering.. many GWC on hooker boards now.. lol

[LynnT]

Originally Posted by HoustonWhiteKnight

Oh and by the way.. a camera don't mean shit. Camera Bodies all basically do the same thing. The lens is what makes a photo. You can have a $300 camera body and pop a $2000 lens on it and take some bad ass photos. FYI

Ah I see it as the person behind the camera and knowing how to use it.. no matter what body or glass. Its all in using the light and knowing how to use the light..

But yes on some good glass!

Originally Posted by **Karla**

Another OPINION

It not an opinion really.. Many agree and so do the experts on marketing. There is actual research and facts to support my "opinion". Anyone has the right to run their business the way they want though.

Im a business marketing geek.

Originally Posted by HoustonWhiteKnight

Veda Designs does high end websites for providers. Do those websites help the ladies make more money = absofuckinglutely yes

Do those ladies use cell phone pics.. fuck no

If you are a $150 girl then just keep on truckin with your cell pics.

If you have the desire to ever be a $300 or $500 girl.. get some damn photos done, get a website ( a real website ), and market yourself differently.

Not sure if you ladies realize this, but being a escort, hooker, provider, whatever you want to call it is all about marketing and promotion. Don't market and promote yourself and noone calls you. Market yourself with crappy pics and crappy clients call (not always, just sayin).
But get professional photos done, get a professional website done, get a professional banner done and advertise yourself as a top notch chick and you might just get some guys calling that never did in the past. New guys join this board each and every day that have never seen or heard of you before. Those are all potential new customers to you and if they see this kick ass website and some kick ass pics, they just might call and be willing to pay a kick ass rate! But if you keep the same free shitty website and the same shitty pictures, you'll get the same shitty rate from the same shitty clients.

What I can't stand is a "professional" photographer with a free wordpress site. If you can't afford a $12 domain name and $40 a year for hosting, WTF. And whats up with people that do pay for a real domain name like dumbshitphotoguy.com and then they use some generic email from yahoo or gmail. if you have a domain, get a real email address like douchebag@dumbshitphotoguy.com


Same goes for you girls. You charge more for your time than my attorney and you can't at least get a real website? WTF I wish those free escort sites would go away.

Agreed. I hate those freebie sites, they all look the same and tacky to me. Dont they want some originality?? Stand alone, be a leader not a follower..

But I do like gmail and use it for day business and this one. Some hosted emails suck.. easier access, and file sending through some hosted emails sucks as well.

[PhotoFantasies]

I've already chimed in with MY opinion that a good showcase can have the best of both worlds.. cell phone shots, AND professional shots because after reading this thread, there are clearly fans of both. A couple of questions, though... if you don't show your face in EITHER type of shot, how does one really KNOW what you are going to look like when you open that door?.. from that perspective this whole discussion is a moot point. I mean is it "Oh baby, that freckle on your left butt cheek looks just like in your pics"? hmmm

And secondly...Lynn... you don't HAVE a showcase, so how does one know what you look like?.. because all I can tell from your avatar is that you have nice skin. LOL It's a nice avatar, but I like to see a showcase in deciding who I see... professional shots or cell phone.. gimme SOMETHING to look at! hahaha