Prism NSA data collection

[Whirlaway]

If the topic is about the policy of "Prism", then the politics can't be avoid.................

Both parties are big government; Bush and Obama, GOP and Democrat................

[sandybridge]

Originally Posted by Whirlaway

If the topic is about the policy of "Prism", then the politics can't be avoid.................

Both parties are big government; Bush and Obama, GOP and Democrat................

Sorry edited more stuff onto post so you might have missed something. I agree to certain extent it is about the policy just weary of people with political agenda will miss lead people from the real issue at hand. Not saying you were. My hope was just getting the information out there. I know this isn't the place people come for news but the more places this can be shown the better.

Connectivity with digital persona is a wonderful thing. Convenience/benefits are too many to list and it is at a point you are at a severe disadvantage without one. Is everything we do on the web considered public domain with every action recorded and subject to scrutiny? Do we own our data? Or is it owned by our service providers, isp, websites,or hardware manufacturer? What type of background data is being collected while I am not even using said services/devices? Can we have privacy while enjoying our ever connected world and still meet our security needs?

As is now, we are not gonna like the answer to these questions. It's basically an all or nothing proposition. I don't think I am the only one that wants to see a more balanced approach to connectivity/ privacy/ security. But its going to take more then policy changes within the government, it's also going to require technology companies to see its users as more then commodities whose data can be freely mined/used to suit their needs.

[Whirlaway]

The "real issue" is the size of government; and without big government, big business can not exist.

It is simple....downsize government and we will have more freedom and liberty.

Big tech business doesn't believe in privacy and most citizens understand it.........if the current trend continues, business and government will overtake our individual freedom and liberty, and with that goes privacy.

[sandybridge]

Originally Posted by Whirlaway

The "real issue" is the size of government; and without big government, big business can not exist.

It is simple....downsize government and we will have more freedom and liberty.

Big tech business doesn't believe in privacy and most citizens understand it.........if the current trend continues, business and government will overtake our individual freedom and liberty, and with that goes privacy.

I respect what you believe, but disagree. I think there are plenty of small/ weak government around the world where big business not only exist but rule. I don't find the solution simple but that discourse should be for another thread.

The "real issue" I was getting at was trying to get people to better understand just how much of their data is exposed and in the least talk about how to secure their data where they can cause solutions aside this is happening. At most I hope it gets people to share this issue with others.

[Whirlaway]

I will respect that you want to take this thread in a specific direction; but one last point. With our constitution and the 50 individual states, a smaller federal government, with power concentrated in the 50 capital cities would make it much more difficult for business to expand beyond reason.......

1. As an individual it is easier for me to get access to to Statehouse Rep than my Senator.

2. If business needs regulatory protections; they would have to lobby 50 statehouses, not one in Washington.

that said, take this thread in what ever direction you feel necessary.

Thanks for the opportunity.

[sandybridge]

I have no delusions, no one comes here for news. That said privacy of our personal data is definitely on everyone's mind. My goal is to spread as much breaking news and share best ways to secure personal info.

If that gets you to talk about it then great, if it gets you to act then that's more then I hoped. No matter what you may feel is the best solution, it will have your personal political philosophy behind it.

Others will differ. It would be awesome to have that debate, but no one comes here for political discourse and I don't think there would be enough participation to be sure all points of view are represented. My fears is it devolves into blame game and shouting match with very little actual exchange of ideas and worse nothing happens because of that grid lock.

If people feel compelled to act I rather they do so in whatever manner they feel is right, without the whole my way or the high way attitude. It would be pretty devastating if people were going to practice their constitutional rights, but then decide to seat it out because the issue got eaten up by a political dogma that they disagree with.

Thanks Whirlaway for letting me set the tone of this thread. I am not trying to gag your ideals or anythings but hopefully you can better understand my reasoning behind it.

Anyhow without further ado more insanity Obama, NSA, Verizon and DoJ are being sued for $3 billion in a class action lawsuit over PRISM scandal.
http://www.scribd.com/doc/146930457/PRISM-Class

"So taxpayers have to pay for a secret program to spy on taxpayers. Then taxpayers have to pay to fight a lawsuit about said program. Then taxpayers are on the hook for any damages awarded." to tax payers and what I am sure will be a generous pay check for the lawyers involved.

[straightshooter30]

One recent example of 'past data collection' being useful was after the Boston Marathon bombing, the FBI interviewed 'contacts' of the older brother. Boxing / gym friends in NH and FL, etc. The FL interview went wrong and the unarmed interviewee was shot and killed. Likely anyone ever contacted was investigated at some level.

Likely just the tip of the iceberg, but you get the idea... Lots of chances to get swept up...

[Jimmiwad]

Yeap, they are after a bunch of whore mongers and he ladies they pay to love. Lock up the computer and hang up that cell phone.

[sandybridge]

Originally Posted by Jimmiwad

Yeap, they are after a bunch of whore mongers and he ladies they pay to love. Lock up the computer and hang up that cell phone.

I get what you mean and I often hear it shouldn't matter if you got nothing to hide but I don't think this can be stated enough, from the interview of the source himself.


"Why should people care about surveillance?"

"Because even if you're not doing anything wrong you're being watched and recorded. The storage capability of the systems increases every year consistently by orders of magnitude where it's getting to the point you don't have to have done anything wrong. You simply have to eventually fall under suspicion by somebody - even by a wrong call. Then they can use the system to go back in time and scrutinise every decision you've ever made, every friend you've ever discussed something with and attack you on that basis to sort of derive suspision from an innocent life and paint anyone into context of a wrongdoer."

Only thing limiting them is time and boots on ground. Data parsing will only get faster/ cheaper and they are always wanting to get better cooperation and coordination from the national agencies and local law enforcement. Is it really outrageous to envision a time when local departments have direct access to a national data cache of surveillance?

Besides with the issue of minors, drugs, and human trafficking, seems they have ample excuse to go over everything with a fine comb, hell sometimes they just like to listen in for fun.

In 2008, NSA Employees Were Caught Listening In on the "Private Phone Calls" of Hundreds of Americans - Including Phone Sex.
http://abcnews.go.com/print?id=5987804

[sandybridge]

https://www.eff.org/deeplinks/2013/0...end-nsa-spying

"The letter denounces the NSA’s spying program as illegal, noting:

This type of blanket data collection by the government strikes at bedrock American values of freedom and privacy. This dragnet surveillance violates the First and Fourth Amendments of the U.S. Constitution, which protect citizens’ right to speak and associate anonymously and guard against unreasonable searches and seizures that protect their right to privacy."

For whatever you may feel it's worth "The letter was accompanied by the launch of StopWatching.us, a global petition calling on Congress to provide a public accounting of the United States' domestic spying capabilities and to bring an end to illegal surveillance."

[jf2good]

If your a Republican or Democrat you all should very happy. It was your parties both of them that voted to create the NSA and the surveillance state, you hide behind things like the "Patriot Act" which is totally unpatriotic. You all voted for the war in Iraq before you voted against it, you all believed the lies about WMD, you all enjoy getting molested at the airport by the TSA when it has been proven the TSA hasn't stopped one terrorist. It is okay to have illegal prisons in Gitmo and to kill Americans without a trial because you call them terrorist, they maybe be terrorist but the terrorist win when we give up our freedoms to stop them.

We have news stories about China and it's great firewall, while in the USA we just secretly record everything, we talk about prisoners in other countries but we lock up more people than any place in the world because our thought police don't like their morality. Enough is enough, sick of the Democraps and Republicons vote Libertarian everyone.

[sandybridge]

Originally Posted by jf2good

If your a Republican or Democrat you all should very happy. It was your parties both of them that voted to create the NSA and the surveillance state, you hide behind things like the "Patriot Act" which is totally unpatriotic. You all voted for the war in Iraq before you voted against it, you all believed the lies about WMD, you all enjoy getting molested at the airport by the TSA when it has been proven the TSA hasn't stopped one terrorist. It is okay to have illegal prisons in Gitmo and to kill Americans without a trial because you call them terrorist, they maybe be terrorist but the terrorist win when we give up our freedoms to stop them.

We have news stories about China and it's great firewall, while in the USA we just secretly record everything, we talk about prisoners in other countries but we lock up more people than any place in the world because our thought police don't like their morality. Enough is enough, sick of the Democraps and Republicons vote Libertarian everyone.

I support you in whatever constitutional rights you may practice in order to right the ship, but please do not introduce political mantra into this thread for all the reasons mentioned before.

Lets put aside being right and focus on doing right.

[sandybridge]

http://www.aclu.org/national-securit...spying-program

and for those more visually inclined here's a nice info graphic
http://www.aclu.org/national-securit...ed-infographic

The real kicker is, technically all this is legal. Executive, legislative, and judicial (at least the lower courts) have all approved it. Hopefully this suit will reach the Supreme Court but previous similar cases have been shut out since government argues it has military and state secrets privilege which when compromised puts national security at risk.

Maybe it will be different now in light of the most recent leaks.

[dreamvacationdates]

Sandybridge: what do you think of Ivybridge

[sandybridge]

LOL. Skip it and get Haswell for more battery life! Glad somebody gets it