Mueller Grand Jury Evidence put on Ice until after Election.

[lustylad]

Originally Posted by smokedog01

The fact that you acolytes actually defend the guy for not releasing his tax returns boggles the mind....

He just does not want it confirmed to the world that he is not a billionaire...

Not sure why you are so hung up on trump's tax returns in a thread that has to do with the Mueller report and grand jury secrecy. But it's obvious you don't know what you're talking about. You can't even grasp the difference between income and wealth.

Income tax returns contain information about income, not wealth. If you really wanted to know whether or not trump is a billionaire, then you would ask to see his personal financial statement, not his tax returns.

Trump releases a Personal Public Financial Disclosure statement every year. Here is the most recent one I could find. It's freely available on the internet, for anyone not too stupid or lazy to look.

https://oge.app.box.com/s/e32qrrfvyx...o7diicwd11pac4

Of course, it's 88 pages and way too dense for you to unpack. So I'll help you out even more. Here's a link to what the experts at Forbes magazine have been tracking. Last year, they estimated trump's net worth at $3.1 billion, down from $4.5 billion in 2015 before he ran for the Presidency.

https://www.cnbc.com/2019/03/05/trum...-3point1b.html

Oh dear! Did Forbes just tell us trump's net worth has actually DECLINED by over 30% since he took office? So much for all those fake-news stories of him being a corrupt grifter whose sole motivation in running for public office was to line his own pockets and grow his wealth!

Btw - I am far from being a trump "acolyte". I just hate people who criticize him for dumb things, don't know what they're talking about, and are too fucking lazy to look up the facts.

[HedonistForever]

Originally Posted by smokedog01

You do realize what the actual mandate of the Mueller report was


I do, it was supposedly to find out if anybody in the Trump campaign conspired with Russia to interfere in the 2016 election based on a phony dossier by Christopher Steele, a lawyer for the FBI changing a document to secure a false warrant to spy on the Trump campaign, a warrant that Rod Rosenstein acting AG said if he knew then what he knows now ( that this was all a set up by the FBI ) he wouldn't have signed that warrant. That was the actual mandate, the reason for the Mueller investigation and guess what, nobody was charged with conspiracy to interfere in the election.



and how many still open investigations were turned over to other offices including SDNY?


A few, none of which have anything to do with the original mandate. That a few Trump hangerons got caught with their hands in the cookie jar have absolutely nothing to do with conspiracy with Russia but then a smart guy like you knew that.




You actually believe that if Trump released his tax returns before the election and it proved that his entire persona was a media creation that it would not have changed a single vote?



That's what I said. I believe that 99% of the people that voted for Trump including me, voted for him because they couldn't stand the idea of Hillary Clinton being President, so no matter how much money Trump had or has, I wouldn't have said "OK he isn't really a billionaire so I'll vote for Hillary"? If you believe anybody and I mean anybody thought that, you are as dumb as you sound. Oh and the other 1% did it for Conservative judges, OK, probably a lot more for the judges but Trump had money, how much, I couldn't care less and neither did anybody else that voted for him and still don't care. If he was penny less, I'd still vote for him over Joe Biden or any Democrat at this time since they are all in the pocket of the mob and I don't mean the Mafia.


That means that you think even less of Trump devotees than I do.


A sizable number of people, a few on this board tell you all the time, they are not devoted to Trump, hell, I don't even like the guy. They are devoted to the policies he is for. I'd swap out Trump in a heartbeat for somebody who would take the exact same actions that Trump has taken and will take in the future. Is this really so hard for you to understand? Maybe you are devoted to particular people which is why you are having a hard time understanding this.


Devoted? Hell, I wouldn't walk out my door to shake his hand and I could care less if another Conservative could take his place right now but that can't happen, so I have no choice, no choice what so ever if I want to see the policies I believe in put forth, Trump is the only person that can do that and that's why I'll vote for him not out of any "devotion" but out of absolute necessity.


Devoted my ass.



Go ahead and call that article fake news or deep state propaganda.


How about I call it irrelevant?


Its amazing that Trump and Fox has you trained to think that literally every time you read or watch a news item that is even remotely critical of him that it is fake.


And MSNBC and CNN, NYT's and WaPO doesn't have you trained to believe everything they say? Please, and plenty of things the MSM says is fake news and 4 years of calling Trump a Russian asset proves that in spades. Reporting that the dossier was "mostly verified? Fake news! The FISA warrants weren't factually incorrect? Fake news! I could spend the rest of the evening chronically the fake news.



I'm plenty critical of the dumb things he says. He is probably the least politically correct President to ever hold the office. He doesn't understand the word compromise which is why some people voted for him but I believe a little bit of the right compromise goes a long way and this refusal to accept the name changes for military bases is a good example. There is no rational reason IMHO to take on this fight when senior members of his own party are telling him not to make a big deal out of this. He should leave this whole matter up to the military, the Joint Chiefs. to decide. The stand he should have taken on the Confederate statues is another. All he had to say was that he would leave those decisions up to the local Representatives to decide and that he merely thinks that criminals should not be pulling them down. That is what the majority of Americans believe IMHO. Officials should decide not criminals.



But none of that matters in the grand political scheme of things to me.


Policies, policies, policies and judges. That is all that matters to me. That's what I'm devoted to.


I will give them credit. They know their demographic. Nobody with a brain born after '65 is falling for that shit.

And the MSM knows their demographic, Socialist and anarchists. There are plenty of people I'm sure born after 65 that are repulsed by what they are seeing and hearing from the Democrat party that has moved so far to the left, it is unrecognizable to anybody with a brain.


You, I have my doubts about.

[oeb11]

+1 - HF
the Lies and propaganda from the leftists never ends.

1984 is already here.

[dilbert firestorm]

Originally Posted by matchingmole

Abolish Ice!!

you need ice in your whiskey

[smokedog01]

Originally Posted by HedonistForever

And the MSM knows their demographic, Socialist and anarchists. There are plenty of people I'm sure born after 65 that are repulsed by what they are seeing and hearing from the Democrat party that has moved so far to the left, it is unrecognizable to anybody with a brain.


You, I have my doubts about.

Do you consider Oeb as an intellectual equal?

[oeb11]

Thank You - puppy brigade

When DPST's resort to intellectual denigration - One knows they have lost the intellectual debate.

LOL

[eccielover]

Originally Posted by oeb11

Thank You - puppy brigade

When DPST's resort to intellectual denigration - One knows they have lost the intellectual debate.

LOL

Yeah, I thought it very funny that the "puppy", after being taken to school by HF, choose to try and call you out rather than attempt a debate with HF.

[oeb11]

EL - thank You - HF is very well written - as Are You.

One of the defining characteristics of DPST is an abject absence of a sense of Humor.

[smokedog01]

Originally Posted by eccielover

Yeah, I thought it very funny that the "puppy", after being taken to school by HF, choose to try and call you out rather than attempt a debate with HF.

I'm not quite sure how him typing out a highlight reel of Hannity's greatest hits could be considered taking someone to school. I was simply trying to get his opinion on Trumpers like Oeb.



The Mueller investigation was not predicated on the Steele dossier. The investigation started based on FVEY information that Papadopoulos telling people that the Trump campaign had received indications from the Russian govt that it could help them by releasing damaging info on Hillary. The Steele dossier, which was admittedly unfinished raw intelligence, was obviously included. To call it "phony" is extremely misleading. It was never more than a roadmap.



I agree with HF when he says that a majority of people voted for Trump because they could not under any circumstances vote for Hillary. Many people didnt vote at all because they hated Hillary while assuming that she would win with or without their vote. She was destined to lose that election no matter who the Republicans rolled out against her. Trump would have never been that candidate if his taxes had been released prior to getting the nomination. His entire appeal was a fictional narrative. People got behind him because they believed that they were getting some kind of business genius and deal making savant instead of a career politician like the rest of the guys on the debate dais. None of it was true. He is laughed at in the business world. If he released his taxes and people saw it in black and white the whole myth would shattered. He would have been the carnival barker that got laughed off the stage after the first Republican debate.



There are plenty of Republicans like HF that know Trump is an idiot but they consider him a useful idiot because he can stock the court system with conservative judges and fast track legislation but that is extremely short sighted. He is killing the Republican party. He has single handedly turned Texas into a swing state. I thought it would take the death of the last baby boomer for that to happen. Thanks to him it could happen in 4 months. The anti-trump sentiment could very well cost them the Senate as well. You hate demlibs now? Just wait until they have both congress and the white house. That will certainly make it easier to confirm a supreme court justice or two.



HF and Oeb certainly sound like equals when it comes to the media. Mainstream media knows their demographic and its socialists and anarchists? You sound like an out of touch old man. Of course the non-Fox side of the press shits on Donald Trump constantly. It is because our reality tv president is an idiot that says and does stupid things constantly. It is not because he is a republican. The guy can't go three days without fucking something up. He deserves to be mocked.



I can't wait to see how Fox reacts to a Trump loss. I would wager that they will do to Biden what they accuse every other media outlet of doing to Trump. If they start propping up Don Jr or Ivanka as the future of the party, then you old bastards won't see another republican president in your lifetime.

[oeb11]

Again - not a Trumper - i favor his stands on issues far more than that of progressive radical H... - the world's most detested female. and certainly more than Droolini' Joe - who cannot speak a platform plank anymore - and is just a front for the AOC/Bernie Radicals and communists who want totalitarian rule in America - with themselvds as nomenklatura.

Open the mind a bit (p)uppy brigade - Fox has some good points. as does One America News. Try it some time - One might find something of value outside the relentless hatred of the LSM with the dropping viewership of XiNN and NYCrimes.



Personally - I would like to see trump decide it ain't worth it and turn 2020 over to Mike Pence.

that would be the best of all worlds in the 2020 election.

IMHO!


as usual - Libdems DPST's make assumption and spout BS about that of which they know nothing and have not the will, desire, or wherewithal to research, ask a question, and delve for an answer.

[oeb11]

". If they start propping up Don Jr or Ivanka as the future of the party, then you old bastards won't see another republican president in your lifetime. '



Afraid of that happening- aren't U - but i do agree the Libdems are working hard to never have another free election in America.

One party totalitarian Rule is the Objective of the OBLM and other organs of the LibDem party.



Curse me all u like - (P) uppy brigade - it just reveals your own fears and insecurities which can be used against You.

LOL

[HedonistForever]

Originally Posted by smokedog01

Do you consider Oeb as an intellectual equal?

I do. I would be hard pressed to think of one issue we have disagreed on.

[HedonistForever]

Originally Posted by smokedog01

I'm not quite sure how him typing out a highlight reel of Hannity's greatest hits could be considered taking someone to school.

Originally Posted by smokedog01

So you think I'm so shallow that I can only repeat what I hear? That I can't think for myself and draw my own conclusions from what I see and hear? And as to Hannity, he has been more right on the facts than anybody in the news. Hannity was first to say ( and the loudest ) the "Trump conspired with Russia" hoax for 4 years was fake news. It was fake news and Hannity was right. Hannity told us from day one that the FISA applications were flawed. Adam Schiff said they were perfect, more fake news, Hannity was right. Hannity said from the very beginning that Adam Schiff was a liar, that Schiff didn't have the evidence he said he had of the so called conspiracy. It was fake news and Hannity was right. When we finally saw the evidence that Shiff said he had from the witnesses he interviewed, we see that he lied. I guess he never thought in a million years Trump would put somebody in office that would make sure that testimony saw the light of day and when we saw it, 57 people, count them, 57 interviews and not a single person, not one ever said they saw or ever heard any evidence of a conspiracy but the Progressives like Pelosi and Shumer and you apparently, lapped it up ( yes, pun intended ).



I was simply trying to get his opinion on Trumpers like Oeb.



I don't believe he is any more a "Trumper" than I am. He like I, have pointed out Trumps flaws often but "the other sides flaws" are far worse so we are stuck with Trump not devoted to him in any sense of the word but since that is what the MSM feeds you day in and day out, you regenerate it just like you are instructed to do.




The Mueller investigation was not predicated on the Steele dossier.


Never said it was. I said it was predicated on the supposition that Trump and or people in his campaign were actively working with Russia in a conspiracy to interfere in the election and Mueller didn't find a single America to bring that charge against, not one. The Steele dossier with not a single proven allegation to support that theory was, in the end, proven to be nothing more than Russian disinformation and even the New York Times had to admit that and yet even to this day, people like you want to dress it up as a "road map". A road map to where? Where exactly did it lead? No where but this is where you are taught to pivot to the "other pending indictments" in the SDNY as some how evidence that maybe they will finally find something to connect Trump to a Russian conspiracy but since it never happened, it can't be proven and tax returns and taxi medallions aren't going to change that.



The investigation started based on FVEY information that Papadopoulos telling people that the Trump campaign had received indications from the Russian govt that it could help them by releasing damaging info on Hillary.



I'm not sure what FVEY means but that investigation knew early on that P. had never agreed to use any such information and there is no evidence at all that P ever attempted to bring it to Trumps attention or use it in any way. I also believe that when the story is told, we will see that the CIA and other assorted actors, set P up. One bit of evidence was when P was given $10,000 and expected to put it in his luggage when he returned to the states so the FBI could find that money and accuse him of taking a bribe only P never brought that money back and when he was stopped and his luggage searched as the FBI was tipped to do, they found only egg on their face.


And oh, BTW, isn't paying a foreign operative to dig up dirt on a political opponent, dirt from Russian Intelligence no less, an illegal violation of campaign finance law? Another law that Hillary broke but was never charged with because Comey didn't want to take her down.



https://www.timesofisrael.com/heading-to-jail-george-papadopoulos-says-he-met-israeli-cyber-security-exec/


https://nypost.com/2019/07/28/papadopoulos-wants-doj-to-examine-10k-given-to-him-by-cia-or-fbi/


Were you aware of any of this? And who the fuck is Joseph Misud? Maybe Durham will answer all these questions but there is no doubt in my mind that there was a conspiracy alright and it was to set a trap for Trump but "they" couldn't pull it off.



The Steele dossier, which was admittedly unfinished raw intelligence, was obviously included. To call it "phony" is extremely misleading. It was never more than a roadmap.



OK, how about we call it Russian mis-information like the NYT's and unbiased persons having looked at this called it. And again, roadmap to where?




I agree with HF when he says that a majority of people voted for Trump because they could not under any circumstances vote for Hillary.


But you felt you had to say that it was because of my devotion to Trump and Hannity, right?



Many people didnt vote at all because they hated Hillary while assuming that she would win with or without their vote. She was destined to lose that election no matter who the Republicans rolled out against her. Trump would have never been that candidate if his taxes had been released prior to getting the nomination.


And in the immortal words of Ronald Reagan "there he goes again". You just got finished admitting the number one reason for voting for Trump, to make sure Hillary didn't get elected but you persist in believing that if we only found out Trump wasn't as rich as he said he was, wasn't the business man he said he was, we wouldn't have voted for him. Trump struck a cord with voters because of what he said he would do and so most of us put aside our dislike for the mans personality which seems to be your sole focus to the exclusion of policy issues.



His entire appeal was a fictional narrative.


In your mind, not in mine because I didn't focus on his business appeal as you seem to think everybody was focused on. It has been said that the three biggest issues that got Trump elected were immigration, judges and deregulation to make businesses easier to start and run and make a profit. Nothing in that had anything to do with thinking about his business acumen or lack there of. That is all in your head put there by the MSM that you seem to absorb like a sponge. See how infuriated you are right now by me telling you that you can't think for yourself and only believe what you are told?



People got behind him because they believed that they were getting some kind of business genius and deal making savant instead of a career politician like the rest of the guys on the debate dais. None of it was true.


And neither is what you just said but I can see you will not be talked out of it because, well, because you can't give up the narrative you are so invested in.



He is laughed at in the business world. If he released his taxes and people saw it in black and white the whole myth would shattered. He would have been the carnival barker that got laughed off the stage after the first Republican debate.



Yeah because those hotels and golf courses and businesses all over the world is something every carnival barker has. And since I'm not in the business world. I could give a rats's ass what these "business experts" think.


There are plenty of Republicans like HF that know Trump is an idiot but they consider him a useful idiot because he can stock the court system with conservative judges and fast track legislation but that is extremely short sighted.


OH, but it is short sighted to elect a senile old man ( Biden) who as Bob Gates once said "has been wrong on every issue" for the past 40 years. Who was responsible for some of the worst legislation that hurt Black people? Biden isn't the useful idiot the Left is stuck with? Please!



He is killing the Republican party.


Maybe, we shall see but if this Democrat party does win because Trump the man, is rejected and we have to live with the Democrat policies sure to be introduced, they will only have the power for 4 years and the alternative will be to put Republicans back in power just as the country did after 8 years of the Black Messiah, losing over 1,000 legislative seats and ultimately the House and Senate, who did nothing for Black Americans and the middle class.


He has single handedly turned Texas into a swing state.



We don't know that to be true yet and if it does turn into a swing state it just might be because of all those Leftist fleeing California and other high tax states and the birth rate of Mexican Americans and other assorted Latino's who are only concerned with getting another open border President.



I thought it would take the death of the last baby boomer for that to happen. Thanks to him it could happen in 4 months. The anti-trump sentiment could very well cost them the Senate as well.



It just might. His sticking up for the Confederate flag and Confederate soldiers might cost him the whole shooting match. Many a Conservative journalist on Fox news tonight are shaking their heads asking why the FUCK Trump would put out a tweet about Bubba Wallace and the Confederate flag when that issue was dead and buried and he just came off a great speech ( at least Conservatives thought so ) which of course the MSM completely bastardized. Trump getting in the way of Trumps success is Trumps biggest fault and it might very well cost him and to get rid of Trump, we are going to put Socialist, Marxist, Communist, anarchist in power and boy, it won't take long to regret that move.



You hate demlibs now? Just wait until they have both congress and the white house. That will certainly make it easier to confirm a supreme court justice or two.


The two most likely to go will be Libs so there will be no substantial change in the court under 4 years of Biden and like I said, if they do what I think they will do, the House will be gone in two years as usually happens and in 4 the Senate and Presidency will revert back to Republicans and round and round we go.




HF and Oeb certainly sound like equals when it comes to the media.


Or we draw our own conclusions from our own experiences and how we view the world with or without the media telling us what to think because you don't think the media tells you what to think, right?


Mainstream media knows their demographic and its socialists and anarchists? You sound like an out of touch old man.



You do know that Socialists and anarchist are on the Left side of the political spectrum, right? We'll see who is out of touch with the murder rate exploding in US cities. It could be another Nixon win when the country gets fed up with the ultra left anarchists and Communists.


Of course the non-Fox side of the press shits on Donald Trump constantly. It is because our reality tv president is an idiot that says and does stupid things constantly.


Like Biden but that doesn't bother you for some reason.


It is not because he is a republican.



Of course it is.


The guy can't go three days without fucking something up.



And lucky for Trump, Biden can't go 3 minutes without forgetting what he was told to say.


He deserves to be mocked.

And so does Biden.

I can't wait to see how Fox reacts to a Trump loss.


I understand that sentiment. I was really entertained by the looks on the faces of the late night comics and the CNN and MSNBC anchors. It had me ROTFLing.


I would wager that they will do to Biden what they accuse every other media outlet of doing to Trump.


Of course they will. Unfortunately, it is the times we live in.


If they start propping up Don Jr or Ivanka as the future of the party, then you old bastards won't see another republican president in your lifetime.

Sure we will. Remember the Left said that after Obama was elected? That's it they said, another Republican will never get elected again and over the next 8 years they won back 1,000 legislative seats, the House, Senate and Presidency.


If Biden wins, I'll be saying "see you in 2 years for the House and 4 for the Presidency.