Illegal arrest?

[WTF]

Originally Posted by grean

Police cannot just get physical and arrest people.

If a police officer saw a person being assaulted, wouldn't they step in?

Why didn't the other police officers there, who were standing right there, stop the crazy cop?

They knew the guy wasn't under arrest and that there was no probable cause. What exactly could they have thought was crazy cop's justification for assaulting the woman?

How can they justify their inaction?

Crazy cop wouldn't pull that shit if he knew others would arrest him.

That is why crazy cop should be fired....not rewarded with paid leave.

Of course LexusLover thinks crazy cop was justified in his actions. He wants Texas to follow the lead of this officer!



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[grean]

Lexus,

If a police officer came to your house and did not have a warrant and had no probable cause or consent to enter, you would not have to let them inside your home.

They could not arrest you for not allowing them in your home.


Your body is like your home. No warrant, no probable cause, or no consent, means no entrance.

I don't understand your position.

[grean]

Originally Posted by LexusLover

I'm not disagreeing with your assessment and the issues you have raised about it, but ...

...a "compromise" may be that the sample and/or results be ERASED/ELIMINATED/DESTROYED from any evidence related to the case for which the person was arrested and any data base holding the results of any tests from the samples REGARDLESS of whether the case is "expunged" from the person's record after the case is dismissed or a nonprosecution decision made by a grand jury and/or a prosecutor/DA.

That's for two reasons: One the charge for which the person was arrested may not be the proper charge and a correct charge filed after the arrest (or additional charge(s)) AND the DNA results COULD exonerate the person from some other charges (in other words he would be entitled to the benefit of the DNA results [I say that because of recent cases in which DNA results have been used to prove the innocence of persons already convicted.] To be specific those DNA results passing through the existing DATA BASE could get a hit on DNA collected at the scene of another crime for which someone was already convicted and/or someone was charged awaiting trial.

LL, sorry. This is what I was wondering about. I don't understand how this "compromise" has any legal foundation.

[garhkal]

Originally Posted by grean

Police cannot just get physical and arrest people.

If a police officer saw a person being assaulted, wouldn't they step in?

Why didn't the other police officers there, who were standing right there, stop the crazy cop?

They knew the guy wasn't under arrest and that there was no probable cause. What exactly could they have thought was crazy cop's justification for assaulting the woman?

How can they justify their inaction?

Crazy cop wouldn't pull that shit if he knew others would arrest him.

THey were 'hospital security staff'. MANY security companies take a "hands off approach and let the cops deal with malcontent people'.. WHICH to me is stupid.. WHY Have the bloody security guards there in the first place, if they can't SECURE someone acting out?

[WTF]

Originally Posted by garhkal

THey were 'hospital security staff'. MANY security companies take a "hands off approach and let the cops deal with malcontent people'.. WHICH to me is stupid.. WHY Have the bloody security guards there in the first place, if they can't SECURE someone acting out?

So you thinks Hospital security was supposed to arrest the police officer?

It would have been awesome if so but not very realistic.


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[instfixer]

Some time ago there was this case of two nurses in North Texas who tried to inform the authorities about the incompetence of a doctor. Doctor had powerful friends, had the sheriff arrest the two nurses, and the prosecutor tried one nurse but got a not guilty verdict. Gov Perry heard about this mess and sent a special prosecutor against those idiots.;Sheriff got convicted of a felony got to serve a couple of months in his own jail. Ditto for the original prosecutor. Hospital administrator was forced to resign -forgot if they tried that fool, the doc lost his license for a couple of years and the nurses got ~ $400,000 settlement from the hospital.
I also believe Gov Perry changed the law to make it even tougher to go after nurses

[Mr MojoRisin]

Originally Posted by garhkal

THey were 'hospital security staff'. MANY security companies take a "hands off approach and let the cops deal with malcontent people'.. WHICH to me is stupid.. WHY Have the bloody security guards there in the first place, if they can't SECURE someone acting out?

Security personnel don't have the power or authority to affect an arrest. They really don't have the authority to detain anybody unless they observed or can verify an actual crime has been committed. In the case of this hospital incident the Nurse didn't commit a crime nor did the officer really. He was just trying to bullshit the Nurse into thinking she was obligated to take an unlawful order. When she didn't fall for it, he went into "Badass with a Badge mode". The Officer's superiors are going to have to reprimand him, they've already stepped into that arena. He could have handled this situation a whole lot better. It's either a lack of training or a lack of supervision that prompted this officer's actions.

Jim

[WTF]

Originally Posted by Mr MojoRisin

Security personnel don't have the power or authority to affect an arrest. They really don't have the authority to detain anybody unless they observed or can verify an actual crime has been committed. In the case of this hospital incident the Nurse didn't commit a crime nor did the officer really. He was just trying to bullshit the Nurse into thinking she was obligated to take an unlawful order. When she didn't fall for it, he went into "Badass with a Badge mode". The Officer's superiors are going to have to reprimand him, they've already stepped into that arena. He could have handled this situation a whole lot better. It's either a lack of training or a lack of supervision that prompted this officer's actions.

Jim

The officer should be fired unless he can establish a lack of training or supervision. Then the person responsible for training/supervision should be fired.

[bamscram]

Just a cop losing his temper when someone will not follow his directions.

[Mr MojoRisin]

Originally Posted by bamscram

Just a cop losing his temper when someone will not follow his directions.

By the Officer losing his temper tells me he took the reaction by the Nurse personally. There's a huge conflict here. The Law, Hospital protocol and the Officer not taking either into account.

Jim

[bamscram]

Originally Posted by Mr MojoRisin

By the Officer losing his temper tells me he took the reaction by the Nurse personally. There's a huge conflict here. The Law, Hospital protocol and the Officer not taking either into account.

Jim

Hospital has changed policy, police will not interact with anyone but a manager now.

[grean]

Originally Posted by garhkal

THey were 'hospital security staff'. MANY security companies take a "hands off approach and let the cops deal with malcontent people'.. WHICH to me is stupid.. WHY Have the bloody security guards there in the first place, if they can't SECURE someone acting out?

I do believe there were other police officers at the scene. They also have been placed on leave. Did I miss read sonething?

[grean]

Originally Posted by bamscram

Hospital has changed policy, police will not interact with anyone but a manager now.

The police officer was a trained phlebotomist sent to collect the blood sample himself. If the nurses do not interact with police officers, what is keeping the police
phlebotomists from just walking in and taking the sample? The nurses need to continue to do exactly what this one did.

I am very certain police with warrants will continue go into any area that their warrant allows.


I'm not sure if the hospital's policy, while having good intentions, isn't benign.

I think the best policy here charge him and strip him of his badge.

Let it be known that police must act lawfully and not above or outside the law. They will be prosecuted like anyone else, if they fail to act lawfully.

[Mr MojoRisin]

Originally Posted by grean

The police officer was a trained phlebotomist sent to collect the blood sample himself. If the nurses do not interact with police officers, what is keeping the police
phlebotomists from just walking in and taking the sample? The nurses need to continue to do exactly what this one did.

I am very certain police with warrants will continue go into any area that their warrant allows.


I'm not sure if the hospital's policy, while having good intentions, isn't benign.

I think the best policy here charge him and strip him of his badge.

Let it be known that police must act lawfully and not above or outside the law. They will be prosecuted like anyone else, if they fail to act lawfully.

Who trained and certified this Officer as a phlebotomist? Was it the Police Dept. or was he trained in another profession? I've never heard of a local Law enforcement agency training any of it's personal to perform any type of medical procedure other than First Aid such as performing CPR or applying a tourniquet ect.

Jim

[Stockinglover]

Originally Posted by instfixer

Some time ago there was this case of two nurses in North Texas who tried to inform the authorities about the incompetence of a doctor. Doctor had powerful friends, had the sheriff arrest the two nurses, and the prosecutor tried one nurse but got a not guilty verdict. Gov Perry heard about this mess and sent a special prosecutor against those idiots.;Sheriff got convicted of a felony got to serve a couple of months in his own jail. Ditto for the original prosecutor. Hospital administrator was forced to resign -forgot if they tried that fool, the doc lost his license for a couple of years and the nurses got ~ $400,000 settlement from the hospital.
I also believe Gov Perry changed the law to make it even tougher to go after nurses

Good job on Gov. Perry nice to see a governor who isn't a pussy. Let's see if that Moron (Mormon) pussy in Utah will do anything.