This takes fake news to a whole new level.

[rexdutchman]

Yupper more proof the libertarts will do anything ( oh I forgot they don't want the truth)

[lustylad]

Originally Posted by Yssup Rider

Go back to your homo bathhouse, or ask your Butt Buddies with some help on the comeback!

What's that you say, oinkboy? You want your Austin Reacharound Crew homo buddies to cum on your back???

They're probably circle-jerked out right now, but go ahead and ask them!

You really miss your pal Lexus Lover, dontcha?

40 thousand or bust!

PIGS GONNA SPAM!

OINK, OINK!

[I B Hankering]

Originally Posted by lustylad

What's that you say, oinkboy? You want your Austin Reacharound Crew homo buddies to cum on your back???

They're probably circle-jerked out right now, but go ahead and ask them!

You really miss your pal Lexus Lover, dontcha?

40 thousand or bust!

PIGS GONNA SPAM!

OINK, OINK!

[Tiny]

Originally Posted by The_Waco_Kid

look at Mexico. 70 plus years of socialist rule and government ownership/control of industries is the result of their low standard of income. their own oligarchs got rich, the people, not so much. this is proof yet again that socialism at every level ever tried is an abject failure.

Originally Posted by The_Waco_Kid

how is it that Mexico, the 15th largest nation in the world, has a GDP of $2.406 trillion (2017 est.) vs. tiny South Korea the 110th largest nation with a GDP of $2.027 trillion (2017 est.) ?

that's less than 500 billion a year in GDP. how is that? it's obvious isn't it? Capitalism TRUMPS Socialism every time.

Mexico after WWII could easily have raised it's economic standard to rival the US had they used their far greater resources properly. yet tiny South Korea, with the disadvantage of the Korean Conflict which set back South Korea into the 1960's to recover, has nearly equaled the vastly larger Mexico.

does anyone on this board think for one minute that if Mexico was even remotely as prosperous as South Korea is, given their vast size and resource differential. than millions of Mexicans would be flooding our borders to make minimum wage at Micky D's or cut grass?

Mexico during the Partido Revolucionario Institucional's (PRI) heyday would be Trump's wet dream. It was "la dictadura perfecta", that is, the perfect dictatorship. The Mexican presidents espoused the same kind of populism and nationalism as Trump. Congress had little power. PRI pulled the wool over peoples eyes, and convinced them they were on their side. But really, as you say, they enriched the oligarchs at the expense of the poor. Through high tariffs and restrictions on trade and investment, they restricted competition. This ran up prices so that ordinary Mexicans paid among the highest prices in the world for things like cement, telephones, and some consumer goods while enriching people like Carlos Slim.

Trump and Wilbur Ross appear to have the same plans for the United States of America.

To be clear, I'm talking about PRI during its heyday. President Salinas, despite his other failings, did start to reform the system. And Zedillo, another PRI president, accelerated that.

Yes, countries in east and southeast Asia have performed better economically than Mexico, and other countries in the world, including the USA. But just from observations on the ground, Mexico is much more prosperous than it was 20 or 30 years ago. You don't see Mexicans pouring into the USA anymore, net migration is close to "0".

Also, rule of law and corruption are arguably more responsible for the problems you describe than the economic system. On these points Trump also seems to prefer the PRI Mexican model, although the case is not as clear.

[Cherie]

Originally Posted by Austin Ellen

*****facepalm****

they just caught, if we actually knew how much the "drive by media" lied, we'd all be pooping our pants. Glad Eccie is back up.

[lustylad]

Originally Posted by Tiny

Mexico during the Partido Revolucionario Institucional's (PRI) heyday would be Trump's wet dream. It was "la dictadura perfecta", that is, the perfect dictatorship. The Mexican presidents espoused the same kind of populism and nationalism as Trump. Congress had little power. PRI pulled the wool over peoples eyes, and convinced them they were on their side. But really, as you say, they enriched the oligarchs at the expense of the poor. Through high tariffs and restrictions on trade and investment, they restricted competition. This ran up prices so that ordinary Mexicans paid among the highest prices in the world for things like cement, telephones, and some consumer goods while enriching people like Carlos Slim.

Trump and Wilbur Ross appear to have the same plans for the United States of America.

To be clear, I'm talking about PRI during its heyday. President Salinas, despite his other failings, did start to reform the system. And Zedillo, another PRI president, accelerated that.

Yes, countries in east and southeast Asia have performed better economically than Mexico, and other countries in the world, including the USA. But just from observations on the ground, Mexico is much more prosperous than it was 20 or 30 years ago. You don't see Mexicans pouring into the USA anymore, net migration is close to "0".

Also, rule of law and corruption are arguably more responsible for the problems you describe than the economic system. On these points Trump also seems to prefer the PRI Mexican model, although the case is not as clear.

Hey Tiny, welcome back. Good post. I completely agree with you that the fastest way to wreck a good economy is to weaken the rule of law and allow corruption to flourish. In Mexico it starts at the top. Wasn't Salinas the guy whose brother socked away millions in a Swiss bank account? The drug cartels rule. The government handed over el chapo to make it look otherwise. That's called throwing the gringos a bone.

Logistically, it would be much easier to seal Mexico's border with Guatemala than our southern border with Mexico. Mexican border "guards" make their living by looking the other way. Btw, net migration from Mexico to the US may be zero (I don't really trust the estimates) but that doesn't tell us anything about the quality of those going back home versus those coming in.

[Tiny]

Thanks LustyLad. Yes, Raul Salinas, Carlos' brother, did sock away a ton of money in Swiss bank accounts. He ran a Mexican government agency which distributed food to the poor, and managed to siphon off tens or hundreds of millions. He was also either getting handouts from or laundering money for narco traffickers.

Raul was convicted of killing his brother-in-law, who was a PRI deputy. He spent 10 years in prison for that and then was released. A third brother in the Salinas family, Enrique, was assassinated around the time French police were trying to question him about Raul's "business" dealings.

Bad dude. You wouldn't know it from all the hyperbole floating around, but I guess we're blessed here in the USA that this kind of crap isn't nearly as widespread as in places like Mexico.

[dilbert firestorm]

Originally Posted by Yssup Rider

Again, another brilliant and thought provoking thread.

Thanks, Neanderthals.

you're welcome cro-magnons.

[The_Waco_Kid]

Originally Posted by Tiny

Mexico during the Partido Revolucionario Institucional's (PRI) heyday would be Trump's wet dream. It was "la dictadura perfecta", that is, the perfect dictatorship. The Mexican presidents espoused the same kind of populism and nationalism as Trump. Congress had little power. PRI pulled the wool over peoples eyes, and convinced them they were on their side. But really, as you say, they enriched the oligarchs at the expense of the poor. Through high tariffs and restrictions on trade and investment, they restricted competition. This ran up prices so that ordinary Mexicans paid among the highest prices in the world for things like cement, telephones, and some consumer goods while enriching people like Carlos Slim.

Trump and Wilbur Ross appear to have the same plans for the United States of America.

To be clear, I'm talking about PRI during its heyday. President Salinas, despite his other failings, did start to reform the system. And Zedillo, another PRI president, accelerated that.

Yes, countries in east and southeast Asia have performed better economically than Mexico, and other countries in the world, including the USA. But just from observations on the ground, Mexico is much more prosperous than it was 20 or 30 years ago. You don't see Mexicans pouring into the USA anymore, net migration is close to "0".

Also, rule of law and corruption are arguably more responsible for the problems you describe than the economic system. On these points Trump also seems to prefer the PRI Mexican model, although the case is not as clear.

Trump isn't a dictator and has no intentions of being one. but if you like, you can refer to him as ..

His Regal Majesty the Lord Emperor Donald, Supreme Ruler of the Multiverse.

progress? well i suppose something as opposed to nothing is progress ..


The average household income is 13,239 pesos ($843) a month and 39,719 pesos ($2,529) per quarter. By income level, the lowest stratum (1) received an average of 7,556 pesos ($481) per quarter and the highest (10) brought home an average of 143,614 pesos ($9,147) every three months.Jul 16, 2015

interesting you mention Carlos Slim Helu. he sits at the top of the Oligarch heap doesn't he?

when i consider Mexico's excesses to the Oligarchs via the PRI, Carlos always comes to mind.

funny that there is nothing "slim" about Carlos or his bank account.


the PRI changed because they finally lost control. but they have their guy Nieto back in office again. he's super popular in Mexico. well sort of .. lol


In August 2016, Peña Nieto's approval ratings dropped to 23 percent (74 percent said they disapproved of his performance), which newspaper Reforma revealed to be the lowest approval rating for a president since they began polling in 1995.[83] The approval decreased to 12% by January 19, 2017.[2]


theoretically that means 88% disapprove of him. but hey, what do pollsters know yeah? in the US they claimed Hillary had a insurmountable lead. how'd that work out for her?

[Austin Ellen]

That's hysterical

Originally Posted by lustylad

Yes oinkboy... the reason our threads are "brilliant and thought-provoking" is because YOU make them that way - thanks to your welcome contributions with posts like these:

[Yssup Rider]

Nice mask.

[Tiny]

Waco_Kid, There's nothing to disagree with in your last post, except that Mexico isn't as bad off as you think. Only a handful of countries in Latin America are more prosperous - Panama, Uruguay, Chile and Argentina. If you adjust for purchasing power the per capita income figures don't look so bad. Using your numbers, 13,239 pesos in Mexico will buy a lot more than $843 in the USA. Per capita GDP in Mexico adjusted for purchasing power is about $20,000 per year, compared to $57,000 in the USA.

Right now the peso's particularly weak. This is because markets believe Trump wants to put the screws to Mexico, and maybe more importantly because it looks like a real socialist, Andres Manuel Lopez Obrador, will be elected president in a couple of weeks. At least the last six presidents of Mexico were believers in capitalism and free markets. If you believe what Lopez Obrador has been saying recently, he'll probably govern better than, say, Bernie Sanders. But if you believe the tiger hasn't changed its stripes, and he does what he said he would ten or twenty years ago, get ready for another Hugo Chavez. And you actually will see Mexicans flooding into the USA again, instead of returning home like they have been.

Some people in Mexico will vote for Lopez Obrador because they believe a vote for him is a vote against Trump. He's the most fiery when it comes to criticizing Trump. Unfortunately, our president has helped create political conditions that may lead to exactly what he says he's attempting to prevent, that is, illegal Mexican immigrants entering the USA to escape poverty in Mexico.

The upside to all this would be Mexican poontang would be dirt cheap. You can get a damn good Venezuelan provider on her home turf for about $10. Having that right on our border would be great for those among us, like me, who are willing to risk life and limb for a cheap piece of ass.

[lustylad]

Originally Posted by Tiny

The upside to all this would be Mexican poontang would be dirt cheap. You can get a damn good Venezuelan provider on her home turf for about $10. Having that right on our border would be great for those among us, like me, who are willing to risk life and limb for a cheap piece of ass.

Why risk life and limb? In this case, I am in favor of issuing temporary work permits so those beautiful Venezuelan and Mexican ladies can travel here without violating our immigration laws.

[The_Waco_Kid]

Originally Posted by Tiny

Waco_Kid, There's nothing to disagree with in your last post, except that Mexico isn't as bad off as you think. Only a handful of countries in Latin America are more prosperous - Panama, Uruguay, Chile and Argentina. If you adjust for purchasing power the per capita income figures don't look so bad. Using your numbers, 13,239 pesos in Mexico will buy a lot more than $843 in the USA. Per capita GDP in Mexico adjusted for purchasing power is about $20,000 per year, compared to $57,000 in the USA.

you realize that $20,000 in US dollars is considered the poverty line for a family of 3 in the 48 contiguous states and D.C? yeah?


Size of
Family Unit 48 Contiguous
States and D.C. Alaska Hawaii


3 20,780 25,980 23,900

https://www.needymeds.org/poverty-gu...SAAEgJ8BPD_BwE


Right now the peso's particularly weak. This is because markets believe Trump wants to put the screws to Mexico, and maybe more importantly because it looks like a real socialist, Andres Manuel Lopez Obrador, will be elected president in a couple of weeks. At least the last six presidents of Mexico were believers in capitalism and free markets. If you believe what Lopez Obrador has been saying recently, he'll probably govern better than, say, Bernie Sanders. But if you believe the tiger hasn't changed its stripes, and he does what he said he would ten or twenty years ago, get ready for another Hugo Chavez. And you actually will see Mexicans flooding into the USA again, instead of returning home like they have been.

Lopez Obrador gives fiery Bernie speeches and it scares the shit out of the Oligarchs. their cartel just recently met with him. perhaps they want to cut a deal? lol.


https://www.forbes.com/sites/doliaes.../#54a8ad931355

interestingly, Lopez Obrador ran against Peña Nieto in 2012. came in second. of course
Peña Nieto can't run for re-election as Mexico limits their Presidency to one six year term. i presume that means he could run again after this election? the PRI candidate is polling a distant third this time out.


Some people in Mexico will vote for Lopez Obrador because they believe a vote for him is a vote against Trump. He's the most fiery when it comes to criticizing Trump. Unfortunately, our president has helped create political conditions that may lead to exactly what he says he's attempting to prevent, that is, illegal Mexican immigrants entering the USA to escape poverty in Mexico.

wait .. what? didn't you say it's not so bad in Mexico? or do you mean after Lopez Obrador wins and goes "Full Venezuela" in Mexico? people aren't coming in these days because Trump is discouraging it, unlike Obama who did encourage it.

and then there's that pesky problem of the 10 million plus already here. You realize what Trump really wants yeah? to use that old spy novel phrase .. he wants them to "come in from the cold". the majority upwards of 70% would qualify for resident worker status, be recognized and more importantly pay federal taxes on their income.

the other 20% or so are the "bad hombres" we don't need. of course they aren't going to declare. so we'll have to deal with them the old fashioned way. catch them. and deport them. on the spot.

and if you secure the border, how are they gonna "flood in"?

The upside to all this would be Mexican poontang would be dirt cheap. You can get a damn good Venezuelan provider on her home turf for about $10. Having that right on our border would be great for those among us, like me, who are willing to risk life and limb for a cheap piece of ass.

i've been to Boy's Town in Nuevo Laredo. several times. i wouldn't go back just for a $25 dollar whore if you gave me $1 million tax free. what good is a million dollars if you aren't alive to spend it?

oh, and by the way if the last six PRI backed Presidents were for free markets and capitalism, why is Pemex still state controlled?

[Tiny]

Originally Posted by The_Waco_Kid

Lopez Obrador gives fiery Bernie speeches and it scares the shit out of the Oligarchs. their cartel just recently met with him. perhaps they want to cut a deal? lol.

I've got serious money riding on this, and I'm not talking about a $50 wager on predictit.com, so I've read some of what Lopez Obrador has said this time around. The guy actually sounds a lot like Trump. He says he's in favor of low taxes, and he's a trade protectionist. He's also a fiery nationalist, a populist. Finally, like Trump, he said he'd balance the budget. You can bet both were lying on that last one.

The problem, is Lopez Obrador lying? Is he just saying this to improve his chance of getting elected? If you go back to some of his earlier stuff, it does indeed scare the shit out of the oligarchs. Furthermore, he hasn't respected the electoral process. When he's lost elections, fair and square, he's brought crowds onto the streets for months and even set up a shadow government once. This is one of the reasons why people compare him to Hugo Chavez.

Btw, Many of the oligarchs, the rent seekers who would rather have no competition from U.S. products or companies, would wholeheartedly support trade protectionism.

Originally Posted by The_Waco_Kid

interestingly, Lopez Obrador ran against Peña Nieto in 2012. came in second. of course
Peña Nieto can't run for re-election as Mexico limits their Presidency to one six year term. i presume that means he could run again after this election?

You can't sit out an election and serve again.

Originally Posted by The_Waco_Kid

wait .. what? didn't you say it's not so bad in Mexico? or do you mean after Lopez Obrador wins and goes "Full Venezuela" in Mexico? people aren't coming in these days because Trump is discouraging it, unlike Obama who did encourage it.

If Lopez Obrador wins and IF he goes Venezuela, including rigging the system so he stays in power for the next 20 years, then people will at some point come flooding into the USA. Mexicans actually started leaving the USA under Obama. You could make the argument that Obama encouraged immigration from Central America, but not Mexico.

Originally Posted by The_Waco_Kid

You realize what Trump really wants yeah? to use that old spy novel phrase .. he wants them to "come in from the cold". the majority upwards of 70% would qualify for resident worker status, be recognized and more importantly pay federal taxes on their income.

This is a great idea. I'm 100% behind LustyLad's plan to import temporary Latin hookers.

Originally Posted by The_Waco_Kid

i've been to Boy's Town in Nuevo Laredo. several times. i wouldn't go back just for a $25 dollar whore if you gave me $1 million tax free. what good is a million dollars if you aren't alive to spend it?

I wouldn't go back for a $25 whore either. You have to pay $80 to $250, depending on location, to get a good provider in Mexico. On the other hand, if Mexico is Venezuelanized, based on analogies to today, $10 will buy a damn good hooker. Take a look at www.sexycaracas.com, and use the current black market rate of 2,951,374 bolivares per dollar to convert. Actually you can have an hour with a very hot woman for $3.

Originally Posted by The_Waco_Kid

oh, and by the way if the last six PRI backed Presidents were for free markets and capitalism, why is Pemex still state controlled?

I didn't say anything about six PRI backed presidents. That said, I'm not sure about de la Madrid (PRI). But Salinas (PRI), Zedillo (PRI), Fox (PAN), and Calderon (PAN) would likely have privatized PEMEX if the political climate allowed it. Pena Nieto (PRI) did open up Mexico to foreign oil companies. The Mexican public did not approve. As you note, Pena Nieto's approval ratings are perhaps the lowest of any Mexican president. So why does the Mexican public feel this way? I could go into a long explanation about the "national patrimony," the involvement of U.S. oil companies in Mexico before nationalization, and U.S. policy towards Latin America. With respect to the last point, in recent decades, prior to the election of Trump, sentiments of Latins toward the USA had improved. We've gone the other direction now though.