Welcome to ECCIE - Sign up today!

nwarounder · 06-29-2012, 09:27 PM

Doove got one right!

I have to say I was definitely against the mandate and the SCOTUS ruling until I was reminded about this. Now, not so much.

(Copy/Paste directly from Obamacare, 5000A section g)

(g) Administration and procedure (1) In general The penalty provided by this section shall be paid upon notice and demand by the Secretary, and except as provided in paragraph (2), shall be assessed and collected in the same manner as an assessable penalty under subchapter B of chapter 68.

(2) Special rules Notwithstanding any other provision of law—
(A) Waiver of criminal penalties In the case of any failure by a taxpayer to timely pay any penalty imposed by this section, such taxpayer shall not be subject to any criminal prosecution or penalty with respect to such failure.

(B) Limitations on liens and levies The Secretary shall not—
(i) file notice of lien with respect to any property of a taxpayer by reason of any failure to pay the penalty imposed by this section, or
(ii) levy on any such property with respect to such failure.

So don't buy insurance, get a penalty that you never have to pay or be held criminally liable for or a levy assigned, and get free gov't health insurance. Seems easy enough...

Ducbutter · 06-30-2012, 12:31 AM

Can any one here name another tax that is levied on inactivity? Not a fine or a fee.

Doove · 06-30-2012, 04:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Doove

And you've not said one word about how this is any different than what Hillary was proposing. Not that i expect you to, because the bulk of it is essentially the same. Meaning, you voted for the damn thing. You know it, i know it, and we both know why you now hate it.

And another thing, Olivia - and prepare to be hammered over the head incessantly with this also - your new hero? Mitt Romney? The guy who you want to save us from the idiotic sort of stuff you claim is in Obamaclintoncare?

HE SIGNED THE SAME GOD-DAMNED LAW. With the same god-damned mandates. So start bitching about him and his god-damned law why dontcha?

Oh, that's right, he didn't take what rightfully belonged to Hillary.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ducbutter

Can any one here name another tax that is levied on inactivity? Not a fine or a fee.

Yeah, the tax Mitt Romney initiated in Massachusetts.

Now, can you name one other example of someone running for President by claiming a law he signed as Governor is the dumbest law in the world for a President to sign?

Talk about pandering.....to a bunch of willingly stupid sapsuckers.

Guest040616 · 06-30-2012, 04:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Doove

Talk about pandering.....to a bunch of willingly stupid sapsuckers.

There is one thing that is abundantly clear in this debate. With all of the bitching, moaning and threats for defeat in November, it is apparent that the Republicant's are a bunch of sore losers! They do not know how to handle defeat!

Guest040616 · 06-30-2012, 07:14 AM

Politics aside, this is the simplest explanation of the SC's ruling that I have read thus far.

http://www.cnn.com/2012/06/28/opinio...html?hpt=hp_c1

"If the Affordable Care Act imposed a mandate, it was ordering people to buy insurance, and nobody likes to be told what to do by the government. But if it was a tax, then it actually gave people a choice: Pay a small tax, or buy health insurance. And if you actually read the bill, that's exactly what the law said. The mandate was directed at "taxpayer[s]". Every taxpayer not otherwise exempted had to indicate on their tax return if they had health insurance, and if they didn't, they had to pay a small penalty."

Guest050715-1 · 06-30-2012, 10:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Doove

And another thing, Olivia - and prepare to be hammered over the head incessantly with this also - your new hero? Mitt Romney? The guy who you want to save us from the idiotic sort of stuff you claim is in Obamaclintoncare?

HE SIGNED THE SAME GOD-DAMNED LAW. With the same god-damned mandates. So start bitching about him and his god-damned law why dontcha?

.Mitt? My hero? Where have I said that I’m a Romney fan? I’ll wait. He’s the lesser of two evils. I’ll prefer him more if he moves back to the middle.

I DIDN’T LIKE HIS BILL EITHER. I DON’T LIKE THIS BILL! I DON’T LIKE ROMNEY’S BILL! I DON’T EITHER OF THEM. GET THE FUCK OVER IT!

I am not the dirt farming, Texas redneck you so desperately want me to be. The bill isn’t liberal enough and it taxes those that it is supposed to help. You are a typical do-gooder. No one but the informed and superior can possibly understand what it’s like to love and care for your fellow man like Yankee socialist that count their money while they spend everyone else’s money.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Doove

When you stop with the lezzie crush.

But, but what about my Romney crush lol.

[QUOTE=Doove;2860014]False false false, a thousand times false. This is becoming a recurring and troubling theme with you lately. You really need to get it together, Olivia.

http://www.cbsatlanta.com/story/1890...sal-healthcare

With the healthcare bill, I can go to jail for not having the minimum level of insurance.

This is unequivocally, without a doubt, false.

As Chief Justice John Roberts wrote in the Supreme Court's majority opinion, "The Act … bars the IRS from using several of its normal enforcement tools, such as criminal prosecutions and levies."

Then Chief Justice Roberts is as naive as you. Never underestimate pettifogging little bureaucrats. No one’s going to jail? We’ll see. There’s more than one way to skin a cat. All they really would have to do is ledger payment of federal income tax to Obama’s “I have a dream” tax and boom, you’re on the hook for federal income tax evasion. Maybe it will be that American’s don’t pay their additional bullshit taxes on long-term investments. (http://www.smartmoney.com/taxes/inco...1335896160486/) Maybe these won’t be how it’s done, but it will be done. Americans will be harassed, ensnared, incarcerated or have their homes taken from them.

Doove · 06-30-2012, 11:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by OliviaHoward

I DIDN’T LIKE HIS BILL EITHER. I DON’T LIKE THIS BILL! I DON’T LIKE ROMNEY’S BILL! I DON’T EITHER OF THEM. GET THE FUCK OVER IT!

Alright, sorry. I guess i only noticed you insulting Obama over the healthcare mandate (that Hillary also supported)

I'll try to pay more attention.

Quote:

Then Chief Justice Roberts is as naive as you. Never underestimate pettifogging little bureaucrats. No one’s going to jail? We’ll see.

Well, ok. You can argue anything is bad when you're willing to insert pretend things into it that you don't like.

Death panels, anyone?

WTF · 06-30-2012, 11:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ducbutter

Can any one here name another tax that is levied on inactivity? Not a fine or a fee.

It is based on the activity that you may use the healthcare system.

Not that you have to but that you might.

We all pay taxes on shit that we will never use.

I will never run for office but I pay taxes that go to pay the salary of these dipshit Tea Nuts! I could run for office but zi won't but I pay taxes for that inactivity.

CJ7 · 06-30-2012, 01:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ducbutter

Can any one here name another tax that is levied on inactivity? Not a fine or a fee.

I was going to say Congress, but WTF sunk that ship.

sob's are the epitome of inactivity and taxpayers pay them $150K a year

essence · 06-30-2012, 02:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by essence

Do you think there is a problem?

Clearly those who want to keep the status quo (we still haven;t heard about the republican alternative) are 'hear no evil, see no evil, speak no evil'.

They don't even accept there is a problem.

Ducbutter · 06-30-2012, 03:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by WTF

It is based on the activity that you may use the healthcare system.

Not that you have to but that you might.

We all pay taxes on shit that we will never use.

I will never run for office but I pay taxes that go to pay the salary of these dipshit Tea Nuts! I could run for office but zi won't but I pay taxes for that inactivity.

I repectfully disagree. The "tax" part of the bill only goes into effect if you do not act to get insurance. Sure I might use the healthcare system, but why should I have pay for might. Between the ages of 20 to 30 I went to the doctor about twice. Why should I have to pay
2 to $300 a month for that? This form of "tax" defines the word regressive.

I think your getting a little far afield though with the tea party bashing part of your response. Fed. legislators are paid out of the general fund (to the best of my limited knowledge) which is funded by our income taxes. You don't supply the money for that because you don't hold office, you pay taxes because you exchange some good or service for money. Not to mention that even federal legislators pay taxes and they do hold office.
I can think of several federal employees who's check I'd like to cancel but that's not what I was asking.

Guest050715-1 · 07-01-2012, 10:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Doove

Alright, sorry. I guess i only noticed you insulting Obama over the healthcare mandate (that Hillary also supported)

I'll try to pay more attention.

I don’t care who supported or didn’t support the bill. What some Yankee does in his do-gooder, Kennedyesk state means nothing to me whether Hillary supported it or not. We’ve discussed this before. I feel that Hillary failed miserably when Clinton asked her to chair the commission on universal healthcare.

It’s a bad bill. Ducbutter said it right, why should anyone pay for something that they may or may not use if they don’t to. Obama and the Democratic Congress didn’t do that. They sold out to their special interests and now we have this abortion. An abortion that is going to be abused nine ways to Sunday before it even begins to take flight and have a hope of being sustained in the black.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Doove

Well, ok. You can argue anything is bad when you're willing to insert pretend things into it that you don't like.

Made up? Naw. The abuses will be flagrant on both sides: the babos and industry. We’ll see. Wanna wager that no one goes to jail behind this newest bit of corporate welfare and favoritism?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Doove

Death panels, anyone?

We have them now. It's called insurance companies, and your boy just mandated that we all buy from them with no umbrella of protection from the feds. What, the IRS is going to prevent the insurance companies from practicing medicine.

Besides, if someone want's extreme end of life or premie care, they should have to have a special rider and pay for the service.

Doove · 07-01-2012, 10:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by OliviaHoward

Ducbutter said it right, why should anyone pay for something that they may or may not use if they don’t to.

Boy, if only i could get all that money back from all the shit i pay for but don't use. Including all that car insurance i've paid for during the last 30 years, i might add.

Sexyeccentric1 · 07-01-2012, 11:03 AM

Well it looks like America is divided on its opinion of the passage of the new Health Care Law. I suspect as people start receiving the benefits from the new Health Care Law and find that is not the evil thing the Republicans made it out to be, it will in fact make it harder for them to justify trying to get rid of it or repeal it. I also suspect that the Governors who are carrying on about not participating in the new health care law as well as the medicaid expansion are risking much with their political careers. So it will be interesting to see how this all plays out as time goes by.

Doove · 07-01-2012, 11:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by OliviaHoward

Besides, if someone want's extreme end of life or premie care, they should have to have a special rider and pay for the service.

Ya know what, that's not a bad thought. I could get on board with something like that.

But ya know what else? The chances of getting the perfect bill out of the starting gate were zero. The chance of you getting everything you wanted, or me getting everything i wanted, or anyone in here getting everything they wanted were absolutely zero. And it doesn't matter who the President is/was at the time. There are far far far too many dynamics at play here.

We got something. If it turns out to be a disaster, well, it's only a law, we can change it. Which goes to the crux of the mad dash to repeal the thing. People who want to repeal it are afraid of one thing and one thing only - that it'll prove to be a success. Their worst nightmare.

And if someone goes to jail? Tough shit. It'll only be because they cheated on their taxes. Pretty easy to avoid, if ya ask me. You know, personal responsibility and all that crap.

Do you advocate people being able to cheat on their taxes, Olivia?