For my fellow Libertarian, Tiny

[Tiny]

Originally Posted by oeb11

Tiny - to address a part of your post - handguns in the hands of gangs of minors, criminals, felons are illegal.
of course the criminals will not voluntarily turn in their illegally posessed handguns....One who commits a crime with a handgun - deserves to be arrested and tried before a jury of peers....There are some issues i am for - all gun sales should be through a Federal Firearms Licensee - with background check - and no more exempt gun show or intrastate sales....
we need to update and keep accurate the national database of felons and others legally prohibited from buying/possessing weapons - and that would help in the illegal diversion of weapons to those ineligible to possess them....I am open for reasonable and logical proposals to decrease weapons in the hands of those prohibited from possessing them , and help to cut down gun violence....As I have written before - there are now likely 20 million Ar-15's in america - legally held - and if beta beto and fiden/harris think they will come to confiscate those weapons - they are sadly, foolishly mistaken.

All good points Oeb, and most reasonable people would agree with you on all of them except the last one. I happen to agree with you on that, there would be a lot of poeple mad as hell. IMHO if you completely ignore the 2nd amendment it's still very hard to make a case for confiscating semi-automatic weapons from law abiding citizens. They're involved in very few deaths in America.

[dilbert firestorm]

Originally Posted by GastonGlock

>Have they ever gotten drunk with their buddies and decided to play Russian roulette, with a rifle? Of course not. You use a pistol.

1.) I have a hard time believing people actually play russian roulette.

2.) You need a revolver to play it, and revolvers are a tiny fraction of owned handguns.

there are revolver rifles.

>And after your dog died or your girlfriend dumped you, did you ever try to stick a shotgun in your mouth and blow your brains out?

No. I've gotten mad and cried about it, but never wanted to kill myself for something so trivial.

I have been suicidal in the past about other things.

And I support a person's right to end their own life if they see fit.

you'd have to be in a very dark place and very broken to do that.

[WTF]

I'm for people being allowed to kill themselves. I like to get as close to the individual not the state to make individual choices.

Just like abortion should come down to the individual. Suicide should be an individual choice.

[GastonGlock]

Originally Posted by oeb11

to address a part of your post -

>Of course the criminals will not voluntarily turn in their illegally posessed handguns.

Agreed

>One who commits a crime with a handgun - deserves to be arrested and tried before a jury of peers.
Agreed


>all gun sales should be through a Federal Firearms Licensee - with background check
Disagreed. It helps create a foot in the door for registration, which is a back door for confiscation.

>and no more exempt gun show or intrastate sales.
Disagreed and unenforceable. You have no way of stopping me from buying/selling a gun in a Torchy's Tacos parking lot unless it was a sting or I was caught in the act.

>red Flag laws - any hearing declaring a person unfit ot hold weapons must be with the accused present, confronting the accusers , and with benefit of an attorney. Some states hold and rule on these hearings without notifying teh accused there is even a hearing regarding them.

RFL's are largely unconstitutional, in that most of them find you guilty of something w/o the right to a trial. But more importantly:

>we need to update and keep accurate the national database of felons and others legally prohibited from buying/possessing weapons - and that would help in the illegal diversion of weapons to those ineligible to possess them.

Unconstitutional. The only right you lose per the constitution when breaking the law is the right to vote, and that's at the discretion of the governor of the state you live in, and that is written as part of the 14th amendment.

The 2nd amendment includes no such clause stating you lose the right to arm and defend yourself simply because you are an ex-felon.

>to require all those who would purchase or hold a weapon in america to go through a system such as the BATFE tax stamp qualification to hold a true FA weapon - is a bit much.

Abolish the ATF.

>However - we may come to a system such as to hold a Concealed handgun license to own a weapon.

It is unconstitutional to create a tax to exorcise a right.

>I do not refer to the socialist states of kalifornia and ny - they already are attempting to completely subvert the Second amendment - the better to control the People .

Not to be a dick, but you're not doing much better, boss.

>i am open for reasonable and logical proposals to decrease weapons in the hands of those prohibited from possessing them , and help to cut down gun violence.

You cut down on all violence, not just gun violence, when you properly raise your children with a capacity for cruelty, so they can identify cruel people. The cruel always victimize the weak, and there will always be cruelty, so you have to raise them to be not weak.

>As I have written before - there are now likely 20 million Ar-15's in america - legally held - and if beta beto and fiden/harris think they will come to confiscate those weapons - they are sadly, foolishly mistaken.

>Actions have consequences - and an attempt by the arrogant, self-important , egotistical DPST/ccpers who know better than anyone - will provoke mass violence of a magnitude unimaginable to the fools in DC who think they hold power - and know they were not elected to serve the people - but to Rule the People in perpetuity.

Any attempt to disarm the populace would be intentional done so to cause civil unrest and division.

>an armed People - causes government officials to rest uneasily - and that is a good thing -

Agreed.

Originally Posted by dilbert firestorm

there are revolver rifles.

Yes. There are very few though, and I don't see them as functional in RR, as you would have to curt kobain yourself, and you'd see which chamber the cartridge is in since you're looking down the front of the cylinder.

Originally Posted by WTF

I'm for people being allowed to kill themselves. I like to get as close to the individual not the state to make individual choices.

Just like abortion should come down to the individual. Suicide should be an individual choice.

Agreed.

I actually love my position on these topics, because it confuses people.

>ABORTION IS MURDER
Yes.
>MY BODY, MY CHOICE
Yes.
>PEOPLE SHOULD HAVE A RIGHT TO END THEIR OWN LIVES
Yes.
>SUICIDE IS SELFISH
My body, my choice.

[GastonGlock]

[oeb11]

Tiny - thank you for your comments - Good sir!


GG- Thank you for your opinion. glad it is voiced here!
i differ with you in some areas - - the removal from felons of teh right to posses a weapon has been before SC review. That can be rstored in some cases, and is teh subject of litigation in teh courts.

i personally feel that felons convicted of violent crimes - particularly in which a weapon is used - should forfeit their right to posses weapons.

https://www.johntfloyd.com/2nd-amend...sing-firearms/


I understand teh argument about all weapons sales through an FFL creating a 'backdoor' to 'confiscation'.



and - in the US - the Second amendment is not absolute - Full auto weapons are restricted by teh NFA act of 1986, and , to my memory, 1932. One can disagree - and want the BATFE disbanded - not happening.

best to work constructively with what we have to preserve Rights as legal and law-abiding weapon enthusiasts.

to my mind - advocating for BATFE abolishment ( and all weapons regulation as part of that) is a bit like abolishing ICE.



Thank you for your thoughts and contribution.
Unlike the DPST/ccp marxist radicals - i do respect your POV.

[WTF]

Abortion is tricky.

After a certain point....I would agree abortion could be considered murder. But not early term abortion.




.

[gnadfly]

FYI: WTF isn't a libertarian. He just doesn't like paying taxes and being told what to do.

When it comes to taxing other people and telling them what to do, he's a full blown Dimocratic.

[GastonGlock]

I don't like calling myself a libertarian, I just use it because it's the shortest way to get my point across with some people.

I absolutely hate paying taxes and being told what to do. But I try to be fair about it by not telling other people what to do, and I wouldn't ask someone to pay a tax that I too wouldn't pay.

Can I make "Golden Rule Libertarian" a thing? "Leave others alone the way you want to be left alone"?

[oeb11]

GG - A golden rule - that the DPST/ccp minions and nomenklatura are incapable of understanding - much less implement.

their arrogant , elitist need to control their 'lesser's is overpowering - even to the point of AOC;s re-education camps. And clearly evident in the Impeachment hoax televised these days.
i have seen not One DPST comment negatively about their heroine and her desire to place over 100 million conservative PEOPLE - in teh AOC camps - and up the chimneys of tlaib and Omar.

Not One rejects the ideology of their heroine.
They learned from teh National Socialists and Goebbels well and truly!

[WTF]

Originally Posted by gnadfly

FYI: WTF isn't a libertarian. He just doesn't like paying taxes and being told what to do.

When it comes to taxing other people and telling them what to do, he's a full blown Dimocratic.

The first paragraph was partially correct...the second misleading.

I like telling idiots that haven't a clue about how their taxes pay for the government services THEY LIKE: to fuck off when they say scream about the government keeping their hands off their Medicare.

This forum is like debating a room full of pensioner. They didn't pay enough into their SS or Medicare yet they do not want the government to either raise their taxes or cut their benefits.

We have a country full of lying politicians not because politicians are natural born liar but mainly because we are a politically naive nation that will believe nonsense and hasn't a clue about simple math or how if you want a large military, you have to pay for it. If you want great retirement benefits, you need to fund them. You do not let politicians pull a slight of hand making it seem that surplus SS/Medicare payments are for future and should not cover up the fact that you in fact are not paying you current military wants properly.

[rexdutchman]

Like peaceful riots , and protest peacefully I been watching some of the impeachment sitcom can we say one sided and selective editing

[winn dixie]

Originally Posted by rexdutchman

Like peaceful riots , and protest peacefully I been watching some of the impeachment sitcom can we say one sided and selective editing

Its complete partisan politics

[WTF]

Look...I think the impeachment is a waste of time.

I think the next time GOP congressional members are practicing softball Biden should have a rally full of armed ANTIFA members next to them!



.

[winn dixie]

Originally Posted by WTF

Look...I think the impeachment is a waste of time.

I think the next time GOP congressional members are practicing softball Biden should have a rally full of armed ANTIFA members next to them!



.

Very revealing of your true self! And a very insensitive post! A vacation would do you some good bub.