liberal la la land.

[john_galt]

I guess I should have said this in the beginning but why not have Longer think he has something...
Longer, I have known about FDR's second bill of rights for sometime now. I wrote about it a few years ago. So don't get too swelled of a head. It sounds great but it is unworkable without changing the character of the American individual. FDR was dying when he put this out there. The war was going to be won in time but the American people had put up with rationing and shortages. Some people had gotten rich making weapons and supplies for the troops. Senator Truman was making headlines revealing war profiteering. Domestically the people were restless. Remember 1944 was an election year. FDR could propose and the Congress would dispose.
The second bill of rights was less a political agenda than a political Hail Mary.

How about Donald Trump?

[Longermonger]

Originally Posted by john_galt

It sounds great but it is unworkable without changing the character of the American individual.

Aren't there about 350 million American individuals and don't their characters naturally change over the course of their lives anyway? And don't those American individual characters change? Not too many folks that were adults in WW2 are even alive today. So why not progress to something great? 'Unworkable' doesn't sound like an American 'Can do!' attitude. It sounds like a defeatist attitude. Conservatism's love of the status quo just seems like fear and laziness to me.

[CuteOldGuy]

Gerald Ford said one intelligent thing. (Hey, the law of averages was on his side. We're getting close to when Nancy Pelosi might accidentally say something intelligent, too. But I digress . . .)

President Ford once said, "A government big enough to give you everything you want, is big enough to take everything you've got."

No matter how nice he smiles, or what nice treats he has, Big Brother is not your friend.

[Longermonger]

Originally Posted by CuteOldGuy

President Ford once said, "A government big enough to give you everything you want, is big enough to take everything you've got."

Does the government give you everything you want? No.
Is the government big enough to give you everything you want? No.
Therefore, can the government take everything you've got? No, not really. Unless you kill somebody, etc.

So what you're dealing with is an unwarranted fear of something that doesn't exist. I'd rather base policy on reality and facts.

[Philhelm]

Originally Posted by Longermonger

Does the government give you everything you want? No.
Is the government big enough to give you everything you want? No.
Therefore, can the government take everything you've got? No, not really. Unless you kill somebody, etc.

So what you're dealing with is an unwarranted fear of something that doesn't exist. I'd rather base policy on reality and facts.

So, I suppose that you have missed the framework that has been set up, which could be used to institute a full-blown police state? How about our nation's increasingly volatile personality as a world actor? If we were to stop feeding the beast, such things would not be possible.

[Longermonger]

Yes, stop feeding the beast. Stop electing Republicans that believe in an imperial presidency. Stop electing Republicans that pass laws like the Patriot Act. Stop electing Republicans that invade and occupy foreign countries under false pretenses. Stop electing Republicans that pass laws that hollow out the middle class and concentrate power to their Wall Street billionaire masters. Stop electing Republicans that go on a spending spree with taxpayers' money and then use that to get re-elected by blaming it on Democrats. Yes, by all means stop feeding the beast.

[CuteOldGuy]

Originally Posted by Longermonger

Yes, stop feeding the beast. Stop electing Republicans that believe in an imperial presidency. Ok, I can go along with that. Let's include the Democrats as well. Stop electing Republicans that pass laws like the Patriot Act. Wow, Longer, two right in a row! Now let's also stop electing Democrats who promise to repeal the Patriot Act, and then don't. Stop electing Republicans that invade and occupy foreign countries under false pretenses. Longer, you're on a roll. Let's also quit electing Democrats who promise to pull us out and then don't. Stop electing Republicans that pass laws that hollow out the middle class and concentrate power to their Wall Street billionaire masters. I agree, but this isn't solely a Republican game, the Democrats are pretty popular on Wall Street, too. Stop electing Republicans that go on a spending spree with taxpayers' money and then use that to get re-elected by blaming it on Democrats. Again, right, and let's also stop electing Democrats who go on a spending spree and use it to get re-elected by blaming it on Republicans. Yes, by all means stop feeding the beast.

Longer, pretty good answer. I give you a B-. Way to go!

[john_galt]

Would you describe an imperial presidency? Things like concealing your true intentions. Or taking money from people to give to your people? How about locking the doors so the opposition cannot participate? How about a Justice department tanking cases where the perp is a friend of the administration? How about selectively enforcing the laws of the land? Committing Americans to war without a vote of the Congress? How about spending taxpayer money on your own parties, private planes, perks, perks for friends, and great bonuses for your employees. How about producing laws that give you and your friends a leg up on the competition and holding down the rest?
All of these charges are being made against Obama, Pelosi, Reid, and their union thugs.

No, characters don't change so much over time without an external force being applied which creates an epiphany and change. A substantive part of that character is wanting to be compensated for your efforts proportional to your efforts. Even Barack understands this. Listen to some of his speeches.