Prostitution notwithstanding, is the word whore - in any way - a pejorative or is it not?

[DickEmDown]

Originally Posted by OliviaHoward

My bad, I did miss that. Jesus, bet family gatherings at your place is a trip then. But you have to know that's out of the norm. It's also out of the norm to admit it. So kudos to you.

Maybe to you OH, but we're all different. I didn't know you somehow became the "End all Be all" on what's considered normal and what isn't

Originally Posted by OliviaHoward

Google is your friend

Yes it is....and yes, I know it's been posted before, but not on this thread.

You keep saying "Prostitution aside & Prostitution Notwithstanding"...how can you exclude the word "prostitute" when the mere definition of the word "Whore", includes Prostitute.

Oh yeah, I forgot, OH lives by her own set of rules that she tries to impose on everyone else....Got it




Definition of WHORE

1: a woman who engages in sexual acts for money : prostitute; also : a promiscuous or immoral woman
2: a male who engages in sexual acts for money
3: a venal or unscrupulous person


Examples of WHORE
<a historic district of the seaport that was once notorious for the whores who gathered there>
<a society in which men commonly regard women as either Madonnas or whores>


Origin of WHORE
Middle English hore, from Old English hōre; akin to Old Norse hōra whore, hōrr adulterer, Latin carus dear — more at charity
First Known Use: before 12th century
Related to WHORE


Synonyms
bawd, call girl, cocotte, courtesan, drab, harlot, hooker, hustler, sex worker, streetwalker, strumpet, tart, prostitute


Related Words
madam, madame; white slave; bimbo [slang], chippie (also chippy), doxy (also doxie), floozy (or floozie), tramp; bitch, hussy, jade, minx; coquette, flirt, libertine, siren, tempter, temptress, vamp, wench


*Don't see Provider anywhere on this list*




So, let me get this straight....you're ok with being called ANY of the "Synonyms" or "Related Words" above? Or is it just the word "Whore" that bothers you? Prostitution notwithstanding.....

[Guest062114-5]

Minx!!!

I made the related words list!

[Hot to Trot Daphne]

No offense dear, but I prefer whore...

It's has a certain, what do you call it?

Je ne se qua.

[Guest062114-5]

Originally Posted by Luxury Daphne

Butt butt butt, its factual. The fact that you don't like it is irrelevant.

the word refers to woman that sells sex for money.

It is the act itself (slinging pussy) that makes the word offensive, not the word itself.

If whore takes offense to being called a whore, perhaps she shouldn't be one.

Yeah the word is dirty, and so is the act. What, you become pc when you take the cock out of your mouth?

Hilarious!

You make a very interesting point here. One that's been bouncing around in my head.

By saying that the words "whore" or "prostitute" are insults, I feel one says that the act of whoring or prostitution is bad, immoral, and wrong.

While I don't think it's exactly the same as the "whore power" that EW referred to, it's related.

I don't like when women who choose to receive money in exchange for sexual favors, deny that they are whores the technical sense of the word (pejorative notwithstanding) because I find it divisive.

I feel like it's a way to set themselves apart from another group of women who sell sex.

There's a hierarchy of sorts that was been stated before. I see where it comes from but I don't like it. I think it serves to keep prostitution illegal and socially unacceptable.

Usually the hierarchy starts with Streetwalkers and ends with High Class Escorts. I like to extend this to include Sugar Babies (who fit near the upper end of the scale) and ending with Kept Women at the high end. Some people take issue with me including SBs and Kept women, but I think their inclusion is integral to moving past the current social stigma of prostitution.

I've said it before, I'll say it again. The only difference between a streetwalker and a kept woman is geography and security... and volume.

A whore is a whore is a whore.

If you don't think there's anything wrong with selling sex, then why SHOULD the word WHORE have a pejorative meaning?

As LD stated, maybe it's not be word but actually the associated act that people find offensive. If that is the case, maybe years from now, people will be hurling the word "provider" as an insult instead of "whore."

[Old-T]

Originally Posted by LilMynx69

You make a very interesting point here. One that's been bouncing around in my head.

By saying that the words "whore" or "prostitute" are insults, I feel one says that the act of whoring or prostitution is bad, immoral, and wrong.

While I don't think it's exactly the same as the "whore power" that EW referred to, it's related.

I don't like when women who choose to receive money in exchange for sexual favors, deny that they are whores the technical sense of the word (pejorative notwithstanding) because I find it divisive.

I feel like it's a way to set themselves apart from another group of women who sell sex.

There's a hierarchy of sorts that was been stated before. I see where it comes from but I don't like it. I think it serves to keep prostitution illegal and socially unacceptable.

Usually the hierarchy starts with Streetwalkers and ends with High Class Escorts. I like to extend this to include Sugar Babies (who fit near the upper end of the scale) and ending with Kept Women at the high end. Some people take issue with me including SBs and Kept women, but I think their inclusion is integral to moving past the current social stigma of prostitution.

I've said it before, I'll say it again. The only difference between a streetwalker and a kept woman is geography and security... and volume.

A whore is a whore is a whore.

If you don't think there's anything wrong with selling sex, then why SHOULD the word WHORE have a pejorative meaning?

As LD stated, maybe it's not be word but actually the associated act that people find offensive. If that is the case, maybe years from now, people will be hurling the word "provider" as an insult instead of "whore."

I understand your point, but I disagree with it. Words have shades of meaning, and while they may be synonyms in the first order of the meaning, the richness of the English language lies in the fact that there are secondary meanings or traits that the different supposed synonyms don’t all possess.

For instance, GFE and PSE are both selling sex, but they are selling more (or less) as well. They are not interchangeable, and as with a term like “whore” there is no universal agreement on exactly what the subtler differences are.

Say the words “geisha”, “escort”, “whore”, and “streetwalker” to someone—even someone in the business—and ask them to take 30 or 60 seconds to describe the stereotype that fits the word. I feel very comfortable that most people, especially most men, will give descriptions that are easily differentiable even though everyone understands the core activities are essentially the same.

Whether we think it is “fair” or not, these terms connote more of a difference than only geography, security, and volume. There are connotations of attitude—real or acted. There are connotations of some degree of a more personal or less personal interaction. Different expectations for conversation or not, fifteen minutes in a car (even a safe one) vs dinner and after dinner erotic activities. The words are not interchangeable, and I still argue that for the majority of people “whore” brings with it more negative implications than “escort”, “provider”, or “courtesan”.

By the way, I completely agree that sugar babies are just another variation of the lexicon. And if you include kept women do you differentiate mistresses?

[Guest062114-5]

I don't include mistresses if they don't derive substantial financial support from the gentleman. Just like I don't include girlfriends or wives.

It's the financial aspect, in my opinion, that I believe makes a lady a technical "whore."

Why should deriving income from sexual favors be wrong? If it's not, then why is it wrong to consider a woman who has sex on exchange for money or other personal gain to be, technically, a whore.

I would take offense to being called a prostitute, an escort, a provider (the worst in my opinion), or a hooker. Mainly because I truly don't think those titles fit my situation. However, I do think I am a whore. And I'm not offended when someone who understands my situation comments or suggests that I am just that.

I understand the different feelings and attitudes the different words evoke, but it's my passion and intent to blur these lines. I don't think we can move toward decriminalization of prostitution without making people see that there are many forms of prostitution, most perfectly safe and not a risk to public safety. I believe streetwalkers are more of a zoning issue. Make soliciting on the street illegal and leave consenting adults alone.

I do enjoy your posts, though. But it may be better to agree to disagree. I have my agenda. You have yours. You go your way and I'll go mine... (I love "Hello, Dolly!")

xoxo,
LMx

[Guest050715-1]

Originally Posted by DickEmDown

You keep saying "Prostitution aside & Prostitution Notwithstanding"...how can you exclude the word "prostitute" when the mere definition of the word "Whore", includes Prostitute.

Because we’re talking about whether whore is pejorative in general not institutionally acceptable abuse and misogyny HERE. You’re smart enough to not try to pull a Peaches boner on anyone let alone me.

Originally Posted by DickEmDown

Maybe to you OH, but we're all different. I didn't know you somehow became the "End all Be all" on what's considered normal and what isn't

My take on normal:

Wife/SO/GF, yes....both joking and in a fight. I tend to date STRONG women so me calling them ANY name other than their given name in a fight isn't going to piss them off. They would just come right back at me with something

No they are not strong, they are women that are willing to put up with your verbal abuse for whatever reason. They may also be full-fledged drama queens that love the fighting and making up, but in all instances they are judged and abused verbally by you.

And YES, I have called "any of them" a whore or slut or bitch..."in anger". So, if a fight did break out, it didn't spiral into shit just because I used a "WORD"

I feel you on this one to a point. I grew up poor white trash. We did the same thing except we used different words to judge and the subsequently start fights with. Not saying you / y’all do it wrong. That would be judging. I’m just saying y’all took a different path to the same conclusion.

So, no, I don’t think it’s normal to call women you love whores. But you do you.

Peace –

[Guest050715-1]

Originally Posted by Luxury Daphne

No offense dear, but I prefer whore...

It's has a certain, what do you call it?

Je ne se qua.

I really normally don’t do this, but no it does not have a certain je ne sais quoi. Let alone the sophisticated French kinda way that you are implying.

Originally Posted by LilMynx69

There's a hierarchy of sorts that was been stated before. I see where it comes from but I don't like it. I think it serves to keep prostitution illegal and socially unacceptable.

Then thing that keeps prostitution illegal and socially unacceptable is the social pressure applied by OTHER WOMEN and the men and women of the religious right. You’re serious now, but earlier you were flirting with the men on the board by claiming your unadulterated love of the word whore. You may have been playing the game for financial gain, but other women aren’t as clever, beautiful or as well placed as you.

Originally Posted by LilMynx69

Some people take issue with me including SBs and Kept women, but I think their inclusion is integral to moving past the current social stigma of prostitution.

Originally Posted by LilMynx69

I've said it before, I'll say it again. The only difference between a streetwalker and a kept woman is geography and security... and volume.

I agree. But I don’t agree that my status as a very high end prostitute makes me any better than a streetwalker. It just makes me luckier. As far as I’m concerned it’s the same difference between poor and the bourgeois (I’m using it in the vernacular to describe the upper-middle to upper classes not it’s actual but former definition of the middle class.).

Originally Posted by LilMynx69

A whore is a whore is a whore.

I literally couldn’t disagree with you more. The LEGAL term is prostitute. Not only does the legal term cover all the stigma and behaviors, it enjoys the distinction of being the ACUTAL word to define the act. Whore is a social term used to label loose women in general and specifically a byword with all the nastiness intended by the user. Thus all the fights DeD’s family gets into.

Originally Posted by LilMynx69

If you don't think there's anything wrong with selling sex, then why SHOULD the word WHORE have a pejorative meaning?

Then walk up to any woman today and call her a whore to her face. See what that gets you. You’re drinking their cool aide. You are a PROSTITUTE not a WHORE. One is a legal state and the other is social slang that has no legal merit. THINK ABOUT IT!

Originally Posted by LilMynx69

As LD stated, maybe it's not be word but actually the associated act t

Originally Posted by LilMynx69

hat people find offensive. If that is the case, maybe years from now, people will be hurling the word "provider" as an insult instead of "whore."

LD has spent the last three days trying to justify her rude ass behavior, and to convince herself this is what she wanted when in reality it was because she can’t stand SL and knows she can’t get to him.

Whore is an umbrella term, not a mere synonym.

No, it is a social slur. The actual legal state of selling sex for money is PROSTITUTE. How sexy is that to scream from the mountain top or have some asshole whisper in your ear?

And this is the crux of the matter – especially the bolded part:

Originally Posted by Old-T

Say the words “geisha”, “escort”, “whore”, and “streetwalker” to someone—even someone in the business—and ask them to ta
ke 30 or 60 seconds to describe the stereotype that fits the word. I feel very comfortable that most people, especially most men, will give descriptions that are easily differentiable even though everyone understands the core activities are essentially the same.

You’re smart Mynx, please stop settling for the crumbs. Market yourself and make your money by all means, but please don’t buy into it. And for God’s sake please stop trying to convince other women that don’t have your social resources that it’s ok to accept being called a whore by men or women trying to please men.

Originally Posted by LilMynx69

Why should deriving income from sexual favors be

Originally Posted by LilMynx69

wrong? If it's not, then why is it wrong to consider a woman who has sex on exchange for money or other personal gain to be, technically, a whore.

It isn’t Mynx, it just isn’t wrong so don’t let someone call you a whore and pretend that they are calling you a prostitute. What they are doing when they call you a whore is judging you. Condemning you. And abusing you – for their entertainment or, in the case of other women, to exclude you from polite society and to exclude you from being a socially acceptable woman and thereby excluding you as competition for male attention and resources. THAT’S what is going on period. The end.

[DickEmDown]

So now you're a Psychologist along with being a whore....or should I say "used to be whore"


Here's a hint OH...you shouldn't believe EVERYTHING you read and see on the Interwebs...often times people may be fucking with you just to fuck with you


Am I, or am I not....only I know

[bambino]

I get a woody when HOs type in French. Oo lala!

[Old-T]

Olivia, I want to take something you said and amplify it.

I do think the difference between whore and prostitute is significant in how it is perceived. "Prostitute" I believe connotes sex for money. "Whore" is often used in a broader sense: sex for something of value. Sleeping with the boss for a promotion, the "other woman" who knows there is no wedding ring but lots of gifts and trips. Those would not accurately be prostitutes, but many people would see them as whores.

[Guest062114-5]

I didn't want to try to do those funky multi-quote things...gets too messy on my iPad. But here's a response, Olivia. I don't wholly disagree and I thank you for responding with a cogent argument with few personal attacks. Though, I must note that your KoolAid comment is indeed unwarranted and inappropriate.
______________________________ ______________________________ ____


pros·ti·tute (prst-tt, -tyt)
n.
1. One who solicits and accepts payment for sex acts.
2. One who sells one's abilities, talent, or name for an unworthy purpose.
tr.v. pros·ti·tut·ed, pros·ti·tut·ing, pros·ti·tutes
1. To offer (oneself or another) for sexual hire.
2. To sell (oneself or one's talent, for example) for an unworthy purpose.

I'm sure you know by now, that I am a "word" person. I like to start with the technical sense of the word, and then consider social implications and connotations.

That said, I don't fit the technical definition of prostititute since i do not solicit money for sex acts. I do, however, fit the technical definition of whore. So, in that technical sense, I am a whore. And I do agree and appreciate your comment that we are not better than streetwalkers, just much luckier. I stated those exact sentiments before.

You can't blame the Religious Right alone for prostitution being illegal. Trust, me, I've studied this more than most people. They are the obvious target, but it's so much more complex than that. I won't hijack this thread though.

From a legal standpoint, I see a technical difference between Prostitute and Whore. A prostitute solicits money and accepts it for sex acts. A whore receives remuneration for sex acts/favors. Legally, it's the solicitation which makes prostitution illegal, along with the quid pro quo of receiving a specific money for a specific act.

Courts have held that Sugar Baby relationships are not illegal because there's not a quid pro quo.

That said, my intent is to group all women who receive money in exchange for being sexually available in one category. One that includes both legal and illegal subsets. Currently, I don't know of another word that fits better than WHORE.

Additionally, and thank you of your kind words and compliments. If enough (over)educated, attractive, successful (outside of this business) women are willing to be honest with themselves and call themselves whores (again, in the technical sense), how can that NOT help remove the stigma of the word?

If someone calls me UGLY and I just shrug my shoulders and ignore him...he will stop doing it rather quickly. I don't give that much power to any word.

[Guest062114-5]

Originally Posted by Old-T

Olivia, I want to take something you said and amplify it.

I do think the difference between whore and prostitute is significant in how it is perceived. "Prostitute" I believe connotes sex for money. "Whore" is often used in a broader sense: sex for something of value. Sleeping with the boss for a promotion, the "other woman" who knows there is no wedding ring but lots of gifts and trips. Those would not accurately be prostitutes, but many people would see them as whores.

You make me want to lick you all over in exchange for something of value!

Thank you. While I'm happy to agree that the word WHORE is many times used to "keep loose women in their place" or attempt to warn young women of the evils of promiscuity, I would love to change that.

Give me a new word that fits and I'll use it....

[Guest050715-1]

Mynx, I don't have time to respond properly, but I assure you I didn't mean the Koolaide comment as an insult. I was just lazy and condensing a broader idea to one word. I apologize if you if it came off as an insult.

[Guest062114-5]

Originally Posted by OliviaHoward

Mynx, I don't have time to respond properly, but I assure you I didn't mean the Koolaide comment as an insult. I was just lazy and condensing a broader idea to one word. I apologize if you if it came off as an insult.

My skin is thicker than that, and while I know that you say things in a moment of passion...I've tried to suggest before that your arguments are better when you don't make them personal.

I think even you can admit that it's quite laughable that I am going hold onto any belief without critical examination. Hell, I can't decide what's for lunch without critical examination.

So, of course, I'm going to take offense when you suggest my thought or beliefs that I've spent DECADES developing are, in anyway associated with how men act on ECCIE.

BUT, I know that was not your intent. But, I did want to bring it to your attention. Thank ÿou for the prompt apology; it's accepted and appreciated.

Carry on!

xoxo,
LMx