Odds on Trump's Impeachment

[camero73]

Originally Posted by Copierguy0

Reading shit from a teleprompter does NOT make you a president, it only makes you a YES man from the people that really run this country from behind the scenes.
The president showed us all — he could read! ... So Sad.

http://usa.inquirer.net/1929/hooray-...d-teleprompter

1) There’s nothing about Donald Trump’s vision for America that will make America great.

2) Racism, sexism, bigotry and hatred have no place in our country.

3) Tearing apart immigrant families and banning Muslims is against everything this country stands for.

4) Ripping health care out of the hands of millions of Americans is irresponsible and cruel.

And gutting the rules, firing the cops, and handing over the keys to our economy to the billionaires and giant corporations won’t level the playing field for working families.
But I’ll give him credit: Donald Trump did say something true in his big speech tonight. The earth did shift beneath our feet in 2016. Quiet voices did become a loud chorus. An earthquake did unite us.

Just not the way President Trump thinks it did.

The American people are ready to fight back against Trump’s hateful and dangerous agenda. They’ve shown it at marches and protests and all across the country. They’ve shown it through petitions and phone calls and social media.

Millions of Americans across this country are ready to fight back for basic human dignity and respect for every human being. And they’re ready to fight back for economic opportunity – not for billionaires like Donald Trump, but for everyone. I just wish we could see some RESULTS from all his promises and fantasy teleprompter words.

CG

My response to your 3rd complaint...

3) Tearing apart immigrant families and banning Muslims is against everything this country stands for.

is boo hoo hoo. We didn't ask them to come over here. Actually Obama kinda did.

What about all the black and white low to mid income born in America citizens who lost there jobs because of the immigrant invasion the last 10 or so years. What about all the individuals and families lives that have been turned upside down and/or torn apart because of jobs that once were readily available for us have been given to immigrants, mostly Mexicans.

Because of some financial difficulties myself I have witnessed this first hand. Go to any manufacturing plant in DFW except for some of the big ones that are protected by a union and you will see the percentage of new arrival immigrants is literally 60% - 90%. 20 years ago manufacturing plants and construction was at least 80% - 90% local born in America citizens. I witnessed that first hand as well.

The United States very much needs a massive deportation initiative.

[Moranite]

As if deporting the immigrant labor, especially in the manufacturing field, would solve any issues. It's not immigrants that are taking manufacturing jobs, it's robotic and engineering innovations. Factories will simply not need human input to operate in the near future. Perhaps a few, but no where near the numbers you may expect, especially in comparison to 10 or 20 years ago.

There is no incentive for companies to monetarily hire humans when they can build machines to do the job better, faster, cheaper, and more efficiently than a collective of people can

Even if we ignore technological innovations that will inevitably replace humans in the manufacturing world, it's more reasonable to think that jobs were lost because manufacturing just isn't as lucrative in America anymore. Why would a company pay minimum wage for someone to make a shirt when they can have a factory oversea make it for pennies to the dollar?

Still, America does have an edge in manufacturing in specific fields like advance technologies (CPUs for one). We manufacture very difficult and advanced products that more often than not requires specialized and skilled labor to oversee and contribute to. For these jobs, I highly doubt the run of the mill immigrant is taking those jobs, disregarding illegal immigrants who are even more likely to not be skilled enough to meet those requirements. Of course there is whole issue with the H1 visas and such but that is a topic in of itself.

I overall reject the notion that immigrants taking jobs is a societal problem. Sure it may occur, buts it's not a problem that plagues the country - it's a personal and anecdotal problem at best. It'd be more wise to consider and prepare for a robot taking your job than an immigrant.

[Fishy2]

Originally Posted by grean

@fishy, read this buddy. You'll be suprised.

There are a couple of items, the TTP & the 2 for 1 reulation reduction, that I'll hit here.

I'm not certain of the wisdom in mandating 2 regulations be cut prior to creating another.


The 2 for 1
First, is there any rule against the new regulation being put in place and also including parts or even the entirety of one of the other regulations that were cut? It's just now a much much bigger single regulation, right? So for political fodder Trump can say he cut the number regulations in half but actual didn't make any real changes.

Regulations can be good. New regulations my also become needed and forcing two others to be removed just because, could have unintended consequences.

The TPP

First, breathe. Secondly, I don't necessarily disagree with Trumps decision . But it is really complicated. The TPP allegedly would bring in ALOT of, and in terms we here at ECCIE understand, $$$$$$$$$$$! People have said like 300 billion or so over a certain period. However, I believe the revenues would not go the lower middle class as much, at least directly from the trade deal. I'll touch back on what I mean by directly later. That being said, a lot of pro Trump Iowa farmers think pulling out now may not have been such a great idea.

Obviously, pulling out of the TPP does not mean we cannot make bilateral deals with each country that may produce similar revenues. Maybe maybe not. We don't know yet. It isn't like they won't accept the US later into the agreement if it turns out it would be better, especially since it seems the whole deal without the US may be on the rocks.

I see what Sessions was saying about replacing Congress with a global regulatory structure that takes voting power away from Americans. However, I think congress hasn't answered to the American people for some time anyway either. That's BOTH parties fault. I also think a global economy is inevitable as the sun rising.

I think Obama could have framed the TPP and the tax increase on those making 250k or more annually, much better as well as together to sell them to people.

He could have even used a term republicans love, which is "TRICKLE DOWN" and balanced the budget!


Revenues trickle down much much faster than tax breaks. That is to say if a comany gets a tax break but their revenue turnover didn't meet or exceed expectations, it's unlikely they are going to create a new job, which is what Republican's erroneously believe trick down economic's does.

If a company hits those revenue projections, they are more inclined to create a new job and therefor the people in the lower middle class indirectly benefit.

Framed like this...

TPP brings revenues in but more so to wealthier individuals and companies and doesn't do much for the little guy. it's only fair then to have a small tax increase to those making over 250k to help balance the budget and reduce the deficit.


I don't think that sounds horrible. Of he threw in some spending reductions, Obama could have had a deal I think that would have balanced a budget.

You have really put some thought into it. That is great.

Our opinions mean little... but here is my two cents

I work for the military right now. I am just leaving actually. One of the reasons I am leaving is because of the number of regulations in the military. I am not talking about wearing your uniform either. They have regulations down to a science and its very limiting. The higher ups love the regulations. It is a cover your ass tool. It is something they do to cover their ass. Work becomes less important as the regulating agency and higher ups gains control. ANYTHING Trump can do to relieve the powers of regulations agencies is sorely needed. The economy will grow and efficiency will increase across the board. This is one of the biggest selling points in favour of the Growing the economy. Government is slow and stagnant because of this. Its the biggest reason government Run healthcare is a terrible terrible idea. Health care is a commodity like shoes and socks. Capitalism works. The military is not capitalism. Government jobs are not capitalism. We need to stick to a winning strategy. I have seen it first hand.

TPP- Another top selling point for Trump. The TPP is over. It does not however mean our trading is over with these countries. We will now renegotiate with each country individually. CAPITALISM and COMPETITION. That's the name of the game. No favoratism. We benefit from this greatly. America has an upper hand in trade in many aspects. Trump is seeking to capitalise while we have the advantage. Brilliant.
Global economy? Please explain.
Global trade is good. FAIR TRADE
Global economy may be in the future when the lion and the lamb can lie down together with no fear. Until that that day we have Country and need to maintain our borders, economy, military, culture and language.
I think what you are saying is that we should not have economic nationalism? That we ought to spread the wealth to the poorer nations all over the world? That seems to be the idea.
That is the very thing that England just rejected with the Brexit. The idea of a global economy rather than a national economy is not only un-american IMO it is treasonous. The backdrop of the idea is the destruction of our National identity and sovereignty. It is in fact the reason Donald Trump won the election. He is winning on Economic Nationalism. It is sad that Trump is going through the pains with the Democrats at this time. He extended and olive branch to them in his speech and they gave him the middle finger. Obama has Valerie Jarrett moving into his headquarters in Washington D.C. and they are playing a dangerous game trying to undermine the current administration. More to come from Trump. This fight is far from over.

[Copierguy0]

[QUOTE=Chateau Becot;1059251635]

Originally Posted by Copierguy0

And as far as Latinos and Muslims that have served and died in our military.....do we have records / stories of any that did so AND were also Illegals?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xzkkk-oJ6bo

^^^^^^ RECORDS and if you want more, i have a whole cemetery full with FAMILY'S of ILLEGALS

https://www.google.com/maps/uv?hl=en...C40QoioIkAEwFA


Illegals of these groups have broken our laws by virtue of being in our country...illegally. And these are NOT laws of Donald Trump; they are laws of our nation, established by both parties over the centuries / decades / years.....CB, let me ask you, have you even read the united states constitution?

CB, are you serious?
Do you think those hot, fine, young Latina's ain't fucking?
When is the last time you counted them?
Many or Most of them have illegal FAMILY MEMBERS.
AND they all have LARGE FAMILY'S, even MUSLIMS have LARGE FAMILY'S

These were my exact words:
TRUMPS MESSAGE TO MUSLIMS and MEXICANS: Thanks for your vote and some of you had family members that died for our country. NOW GET THE FUCK OUT AND DON'T COME BACK

@CB, notice i said FAMILY MEMBERS

CG

[camero73]

Originally Posted by Moranite

As if deporting the immigrant labor, especially in the manufacturing field, would solve any issues. It's not immigrants that are taking manufacturing jobs, it's robotic and engineering innovations. Factories will simply not need human input to operate in the near future. Perhaps a few, but no where near the numbers you may expect, especially in comparison to 10 or 20 years ago.

There is no incentive for companies to monetarily hire humans when they can build machines to do the job better, faster, cheaper, and more efficiently than a collective of people can

Even if we ignore technological innovations that will inevitably replace humans in the manufacturing world, it's more reasonable to think that jobs were lost because manufacturing just isn't as lucrative in America anymore. Why would a company pay minimum wage for someone to make a shirt when they can have a factory oversea make it for pennies to the dollar?

Still, America does have an edge in manufacturing in specific fields like advance technologies (CPUs for one). We manufacture very difficult and advanced products that more often than not requires specialized and skilled labor to oversee and contribute to. For these jobs, I highly doubt the run of the mill immigrant is taking those jobs, disregarding illegal immigrants who are even more likely to not be skilled enough to meet those requirements. Of course there is whole issue with the H1 visas and such but that is a topic in of itself.

I overall reject the notion that immigrants taking jobs is a societal problem. Sure it may occur, buts it's not a problem that plagues the country - it's a personal and anecdotal problem at best. It'd be more wise to consider and prepare for a robot taking your job than an immigrant.

Your so nonchalant with your comment "Why would a company pay minimum wage for someone to make a shirt when they can have a factory overseas make it for pennies to the dollar?"

My guess is your a young person and to generationally removed from the way it was to understand what is wrong with this.

By the way, you used a shirt as an example. Have you noticed your shirts seem to be tearing or coming apart at the seams long before they should? Products made in America used to be built to last.

[Moranite]

If you think I'm wrong, then attempt to make a semblance of an argument rather than just pass it off as being 'generationally removed' when that is in of itself a baseless assumption. Discourse can be fruitful when we define what is wrong and why its wrong and bring our points together. Please try to do so rather than assume your point is not understandable or whatnot.

There is nothing wrong with challenging the idea companies have no incentives to hire Americans and build factories in America. The interests of companies, by and large, are to satisfy their shareholders and investors - that means delivering a return or generating profits. Companies exist to create profit whether we like it or not. That's capitalism, baby. Comparing the now to the past is a unfruitful endeavor; the times have changed so much socially, economically, and technologically such that the past can no longer be a meaningful bias for future decisions. Now, don't take this to mean I think it's okay or that it's right or that it's wrong - it's simply a statement of what is. Reality is reality.
I think we can agree, the past is over. 'The way it was' is not necessarily the same as the way it is, or the way it will be, or even the way it ought to be. To me, it doesn't matter how it was in the past - I am more concerned with how it will be going forward and how we address the needs of society as we progress.

Which is why I brought up mechanical labor. Even right now when many companies do employ factories overseas, those workers who are paid little to make these goods will even become obsolete - let alone American factories and workers. Sure companies can still make a profit manufacturing in America, and sure we do produce some of the best goods (as I mentioned earlier, the highly technical and advanced products that require specialized labor). However, robotic innovation is inevitable. They simple produce more, make better goods, and make less mistakes. I could provide sources and documentation, but your own search would lead to many, many articles and papers.

Unfortunately, manufacturing will never be the same, for better or for worse. Technological advancement will change the face of manufacturing, moving it from manual labor to machines. It is no longer feasible to try and remove immigrants or make a push for these general product manufacturing because shortly robots will render people themselves obsolete. I am more concerned with addressing the issues that arise from a society where maybe people won't need to work as society has. Machines are becoming smarter and cheaper by the day. It's rather frightening (I heard once that you should never trust a computer you can't throw out the window). Whether or not immigration was the problem in the past doesn't really matter anymore. Society has changed such that the issues and problems we face are entirely new and different. We could try to 'undo' immigration, but what will we do once technology becomes advanced enough to take over many jobs? Deport robots?

It's not a matter if I think it's right or wrong manufacturing isn't done in America anymore; it just simply won't be possible in the way we know it in the future. I, personally, would like more manufacturing in the United States, but I don't think the way to do it is by competing with the world with these lower end manufactured goods. Our strengths is in our advancement, our technology, our ingenuity. We should stick to those, manufacture the complex goods. Planes, cars, microchips. I don't want to get into a race to the bottom with the other nations of the world producing who-knows-what goods also in the face of automation. Trying to get those jobs back from Americans is a fruitless endeavor because it will never be in the same quantity as in the past due to automation and I think it will generally be hard to compete with the global economy unless you do some crazy trade policies, which is a different discussion I'd say.

Again, nothing matters cause, y'know, robots.

P.S. I have not noticed my shirts falling apart. Made in Salvador last I check - they last me many years. Technically Salvador is part of the Americas, so I guess there's that...

[themystic]

My dad died 2 years ago. He was a WWII ,Korea and Vietnam veteran. He spent his entire life as a career military man. I'm glad hes not here to see the collapse of American Patriotism.

He was also a life long Republican. He was a true decorated American soldier. Being a Republican he held to the core values of the party. However he had the sense to " do the right thing", or to compromise for the sake of progress and or the overall good of the country. He was an American first

Even though he leaned heavily to the right, he would be the first to defend an innocent man and the first to punish the guilty man. That was not a Republican or Democratic belief, those were American beliefs in fairness

Good paying jobs, good education, affordable and available healthcare, freedom of religion, a fair judicial system, freedom of speech and press. These are not Republican or Democratic values. These are the things almost all Americans want. They are American Values and a quality of life that is " The American Dream". A man can literally go from rags to riches. Opportunity for anyone to make the most of their life experience. Freedom!. That is what America Is

He would have been Mortified to the point of total disbelief in regards to DJT, his " policies", the nepotism, his active role in the "family business", the weekend trips to his country club, etc, etc. and his billionaire cabinet cronies. Not because they were billionaires, but their characters as altruistic public servants working for the good of the USA is highly questionable

Leaving aside the obvious character flaws and hatefulness of DJT and his family, and billionaire friends, ( who are actually the ones who created the swamp) collusion with the Russians would have been an Outrage! to him and the others of his generation. In fact it is an OUTRAGE to most Americans today. DJT and his "peeps" will not survive this one

If you voted for DJT under the guise of " Making America Great Again", you were deceived and duped. I suggest you step up to the plate and admit it by renouncing DJT, his family, ( yes they are in collusion with him) and his billionaire cabinet cronies. Dont continue to wave your American flags and talk about patriotism and making America great.

Americans who support DJT, also support Russia and Putin. YOU ARE NOT AMERICANS, YOU ARE TREASONOUS TRAITORS, Bottom Line, support DJT and put your American flags up or do the right thing and renounce this TRAITOR. Guilt by Association in this Case is pretty obvious

[camero73]

Originally Posted by Moranite

If you think I'm wrong, then attempt to make a semblance of an argument rather than just pass it off as being 'generationally removed' when that is in of itself a baseless assumption. Discourse can be fruitful when we define what is wrong and why its wrong and bring our points together. Please try to do so rather than assume your point is not understandable or whatnot.

There is nothing wrong with challenging the idea companies have no incentives to hire Americans and build factories in America. The interests of companies, by and large, are to satisfy their shareholders and investors - that means delivering a return or generating profits. Companies exist to create profit whether we like it or not. That's capitalism, baby. Comparing the now to the past is a unfruitful endeavor; the times have changed so much socially, economically, and technologically such that the past can no longer be a meaningful bias for future decisions. Now, don't take this to mean I think it's okay or that it's right or that it's wrong - it's simply a statement of what is. Reality is reality.
I think we can agree, the past is over. 'The way it was' is not necessarily the same as the way it is, or the way it will be, or even the way it ought to be. To me, it doesn't matter how it was in the past - I am more concerned with how it will be going forward and how we address the needs of society as we progress.

Which is why I brought up mechanical labor. Even right now when many companies do employ factories overseas, those workers who are paid little to make these goods will even become obsolete - let alone American factories and workers. Sure companies can still make a profit manufacturing in America, and sure we do produce some of the best goods (as I mentioned earlier, the highly technical and advanced products that require specialized labor). However, robotic innovation is inevitable. They simple produce more, make better goods, and make less mistakes. I could provide sources and documentation, but your own search would lead to many, many articles and papers.

Unfortunately, manufacturing will never be the same, for better or for worse. Technological advancement will change the face of manufacturing, moving it from manual labor to machines. It is no longer feasible to try and remove immigrants or make a push for these general product manufacturing because shortly robots will render people themselves obsolete. I am more concerned with addressing the issues that arise from a society where maybe people won't need to work as society has. Machines are becoming smarter and cheaper by the day. It's rather frightening (I heard once that you should never trust a computer you can't throw out the window). Whether or not immigration was the problem in the past doesn't really matter anymore. Society has changed such that the issues and problems we face are entirely new and different. We could try to 'undo' immigration, but what will we do once technology becomes advanced enough to take over many jobs? Deport robots?

It's not a matter if I think it's right or wrong manufacturing isn't done in America anymore; it just simply won't be possible in the way we know it in the future. I, personally, would like more manufacturing in the United States, but I don't think the way to do it is by competing with the world with these lower end manufactured goods. Our strengths is in our advancement, our technology, our ingenuity. We should stick to those, manufacture the complex goods. Planes, cars, microchips. I don't want to get into a race to the bottom with the other nations of the world producing who-knows-what goods also in the face of automation. Trying to get those jobs back from Americans is a fruitless endeavor because it will never be in the same quantity as in the past due to automation and I think it will generally be hard to compete with the global economy unless you do some crazy trade policies, which is a different discussion I'd say.

Again, nothing matters cause, y'know, robots.

P.S. I have not noticed my shirts falling apart. Made in Salvador last I check - they last me many years. Technically Salvador is part of the Americas, so I guess there's that...

I didn't know I was exchanging replies with a PHD (seriously) so I guess I better just humbly rest my case. Oh well, I have great memories. I think I need a road trip to Big Bend National Park and connect with nature once again.

[Moranite]

My allergies have been acting up - spring must be here. Its nice to take a trip out. Get away from everything. The night sky is so much more beautiful away from the pollution. The stars never fail to captivate me.

If came of as rude or something, I apologize, wasn't my intent. I simply like to explain myself as best as possible, avoiding emotions and feelings, sticking to logic and reason. Discourse and discussions, from my experience, are better that way.

And @themystic, that was pleasant to read.

[Fishy2]

Originally Posted by themystic

My dad died 2 years ago. He was a WWII ,Korea and Vietnam veteran. He spent his entire life as a career military man. I'm glad hes not here to see the collapse of American Patriotism.

He was also a life long Republican. He was a true decorated American soldier. Being a Republican he held to the core values of the party. However he had the sense to " do the right thing", or to compromise for the sake of progress and or the overall good of the country. He was an American first

Even though he leaned heavily to the right, he would be the first to defend an innocent man and the first to punish the guilty man. That was not a Republican or Democratic belief, those were American beliefs in fairness

Good paying jobs, good education, affordable and available healthcare, freedom of religion, a fair judicial system, freedom of speech and press. These are not Republican or Democratic values. These are the things almost all Americans want. They are American Values and a quality of life that is " The American Dream". A man can literally go from rags to riches. Opportunity for anyone to make the most of their life experience. Freedom!. That is what America Is

He would have been Mortified to the point of total disbelief in regards to DJT, his " policies", the nepotism, his active role in the "family business", the weekend trips to his country club, etc, etc. and his billionaire cabinet cronies. Not because they were billionaires, but their characters as altruistic public servants working for the good of the USA is highly questionable

Leaving aside the obvious character flaws and hatefulness of DJT and his family, and billionaire friends, ( who are actually the ones who created the swamp) collusion with the Russians would have been an Outrage! to him and the others of his generation. In fact it is an OUTRAGE to most Americans today. DJT and his "peeps" will not survive this one

If you voted for DJT under the guise of " Making America Great Again", you were deceived and duped. I suggest you step up to the plate and admit it by renouncing DJT, his family, ( yes they are in collusion with him) and his billionaire cabinet cronies. Dont continue to wave your American flags and talk about patriotism and making America great.

Americans who support DJT, also support Russia and Putin. YOU ARE NOT AMERICANS, YOU ARE TREASONOUS TRAITORS, Bottom Line, support DJT and put your American flags up or do the right thing and renounce this TRAITOR. Guilt by Association in this Case is pretty obvious

Respect to you and your family for serving the country.

It is important we all take things in stride. We can't make too many assumptions.
I will tell you that when Obama was in office there were many that called him the anti-Christ. They said he was not American. A Muslim. A plant from a middle eastern Country. He favoured Palestine. He gave billions of Dollars to Iran. It wasn't a bad deal it was a gift. He didn't go after Saudi Arabia after 9/11. There were rumours and still are rumours that he gave money to orginazations like La RAZA and supports the BLM movement which has been shown time and again to be a hate group.
We sat back and took it in stride. I didn't like it. I genuinely think that Obama did the best that he could though. I gave him the benefit of the doubt. I always tried to believe he was trying to help our country the best he knew how.
That's all we ask. The benefit of the doubt. Give Trump a chance.
I DON'T KNOW ANY RUSSIANS
I can tell you as well that I have family that has served in every war since the revolution and on both side of both the civil and revolutionary war. Things are not always clear cut. I have close ties and strong feelings for the country as well. Compromise is always needed. Global change has come quick to the USA. Most Americans voted for Trump because they want to maintain our borders, economy, culture, language, law and order and military. It's not nefarious.
Does Trump have ties to the Russians? I honestly don't know and I'm a huge supporter of Trump.
There is theories that Obama could have ties to the Russians. I don't know if that is true either. Their is conspiracy that Obama has ties ties to George Soros who is funding organisations throughout the country to stage protests and incite anarchy. I don't know if that's true either. These leaks that are trickling out through the NYT and the Wash Post may be coming straight from Obama and his connections in DC. The Deep State. A shadow government.
What do you choose to believe at a time like this?
The NYT? The Wash Post? Could all of it be true on both sides of the argument?
I am going to listen to the FBI and CIA directors and see how it plays out. Many good Americans voted for Trump over Hillary. He won the democratic election. The FBI has found no evidence that it affected the votes. They have no reason to believe it affected the votes. If we can't respect the results of a democratic election. We can't have a democracy. In life there are kings and pawns. In this game we are pawns. Under Obama I can thrive. Under Trump I can thrive.

Check out this link. Explains a lot about some the major changes happening in our country. Change is rapidly upon all of us.

Trump won the military vote 2-1 over Hillary Clinton and it is by no means Treason to support him. Fly your American flags and be proud you live in the USA

http://metrocosm.com/us-immigration-history-map.html

[Copierguy0]

Originally Posted by themystic

My dad died 2 years ago. He was a WWII ,Korea and Vietnam veteran. He spent his entire life as a career military man. I'm glad hes not here to see the collapse of American Patriotism.

He was also a life long Republican. He was a true decorated American soldier. Being a Republican he held to the core values of the party. However he had the sense to " do the right thing", or to compromise for the sake of progress and or the overall good of the country. He was an American first

Even though he leaned heavily to the right, he would be the first to defend an innocent man and the first to punish the guilty man. That was not a Republican or Democratic belief, those were American beliefs in fairness

Good paying jobs, good education, affordable and available healthcare, freedom of religion, a fair judicial system, freedom of speech and press. These are not Republican or Democratic values. These are the things almost all Americans want. They are American Values and a quality of life that is " The American Dream". A man can literally go from rags to riches. Opportunity for anyone to make the most of their life experience. Freedom!. That is what America Is

He would have been Mortified to the point of total disbelief in regards to DJT, his " policies", the nepotism, his active role in the "family business", the weekend trips to his country club, etc, etc. and his billionaire cabinet cronies. Not because they were billionaires, but their characters as altruistic public servants working for the good of the USA is highly questionable

Leaving aside the obvious character flaws and hatefulness of DJT and his family, and billionaire friends, ( who are actually the ones who created the swamp) collusion with the Russians would have been an Outrage! to him and the others of his generation. In fact it is an OUTRAGE to most Americans today. DJT and his "peeps" will not survive this one

If you voted for DJT under the guise of " Making America Great Again", you were deceived and duped. I suggest you step up to the plate and admit it by renouncing DJT, his family, ( yes they are in collusion with him) and his billionaire cabinet cronies. Dont continue to wave your American flags and talk about patriotism and making America great.

Americans who support DJT, also support Russia and Putin. YOU ARE NOT AMERICANS, YOU ARE TREASONOUS TRAITORS, Bottom Line, support DJT and put your American flags up or do the right thing and renounce this TRAITOR. Guilt by Association in this Case is pretty obvious

Originally Posted by Moranite

@themystic, that was pleasant to read.

@themystic, a very good read indeed sir.

2 Major things happened to elect TRUMP president:
1) American people took this election for granted and a lot didn't vote.
2) Russian involvement, hacking, and plenty of cash from billionaires.

And who benefit from this election?
Trumps supporting cast that is NOW in office.
Those are the players that were behind the scenes during the election.

CG

[Copierguy0]

Originally Posted by Copierguy0

@themystic, a very good read indeed sir.

2 Major things happened to elect TRUMP president:
1) American people took this election for granted and a lot didn't vote.
2) Russian involvement, hacking, and plenty of cash from billionaires.

And who benefit from this election?
Trumps supporting cast that is NOW in office.
Those are the players that were behind the scenes during the election.

CG

Let Speculate and go one step further.
Why would Russia's Putin want to be involved with OUR election?

TO PUT ALL THE PLAYERS IN PLACE SO PUTIN COULD HAVE
A DIRECT PIPELINE TO USA's ECONOMY, TRADE DEALS, and MILITARY.

in time, we will see how Russia's failing economy benefits from this.

Russian main exports are energy (oil and petroleum products, gas, coal), rolled steel, ferrous and nonferrous metals and minerals. The greater part of Russian exports belongs to oil and petroleum products. Other leading exports are natural gas, timber, fertilizers, machinery and equipment, armaments.

http://www.advantour.com/russia/economy/trade.htm

https://www.quora.com/Whats-the-reas...y-so-miserable

http://www.indexmundi.com/trade/exports/?country=ru

http://www.indexmundi.com/trade/imports/?country=ru


CG

[camero73]

Originally Posted by Moranite

My allergies have been acting up - spring must be here. Its nice to take a trip out. Get away from everything. The night sky is so much more beautiful away from the pollution. The stars never fail to captivate me.

If came of as rude or something, I apologize, wasn't my intent. I simply like to explain myself as best as possible, avoiding emotions and feelings, sticking to logic and reason. Discourse and discussions, from my experience, are better that way.

And @themystic, that was pleasant to read.

That was a complement about the PHD. I don't think you were being rude. You were being quite civil.

[TexTushHog]

Originally Posted by camero73

Your so nonchalant with your comment "Why would a company pay minimum wage for someone to make a shirt when they can have a factory overseas make it for pennies to the dollar?"

My guess is your a young person and to generationally removed from the way it was to understand what is wrong with this.

By the way, you used a shirt as an example. Have you noticed your shirts seem to be tearing or coming apart at the seams long before they should? Products made in America used to be built to last.

Depends on how much you pay fir the shirt. You can get a cheap shirt at Walmart that's made in Indonesia. It will last a year or two, and like,y not wear that well. You can get a mid grade shirt made with better fabric, say a Lands' End dress shirt. Still made overseas, but moderately priced. If you take care of it, it will last for many years. Fir $150, you can get a high quality American made shirt. Say Mercer & Co. I used to buy these. Nice high quality material and workmanship. I still have some that are over 20 years old and while they are getting a bit worn, they are still great for casual wear. Or, you can get hand made dress shirts from fine cloths made by any number of custom tailors for $350 on up. The point being, we have more choices now. The basic Walmart shirt, and probably the Lands' End shirt, cost less than their counterparts from the 1960's. And the two high end shirts are more widely available and I can re-order a custom shirt from my tailor with the click of a mouse and it will,arrive in eight weeks. But we are clearly better off now in the choice of shirts.

[TexTushHog]

Originally Posted by Moranite

Unfortunately, manufacturing will never be the same, for better or for worse. Technological advancement will change the face of manufacturing, moving it from manual labor to machines. It is no longer feasible to try and remove immigrants or make a push for these general product manufacturing because shortly robots will render people themselves obsolete.

Why is this unfortunate? Your attitude seems akin to saying it's unfortunate that automobiles replaced horse drawn carriages because that would put buggy whip makers out of work. Folks will retain for better work or be left behind. Just like buggy whip makers. There going to have to change their attitude toward education and serious vocational training.