Mayweather ducking Pacquiao....Again!

[cg00]

Originally Posted by Sisyphus

...

PacMan is just the latest in the line. "Money" will shuck & jive, duck & dive, until Manny has lost a step, had a problem, or shows some sort of weakness. Then, & only then, he'll take some promoter's money to beat the name - not the man. Then he will beat his chest & loudly proclaim that he's taken another step to cement his legacy as the greatest of all time.

Sisphyus, man you pretty much took the words right out of my mouth. Pacman got heart. He will fight the best there is at that time win, lose or draw. He has done all with the best. Besides Zab Judah, I don't think Money has fought anyone in their prime. First time Money had to deal with speed and a little power. And Judah hurt him good in that fight. Each time I watch the knock down that was called a slip on Money I am more convinced Jab had him for a short time in that bout. Zab and his dad should have kept the pressure on Money instead of getting pissed at the ref. Looking at the Welterweight division for the last 5 years, he ducked a lot talent in their prime To be fair to him though, most these guys were naturally 7-10 pounds heavier than him. He was smart not to take those fight from a win-loss point of view. Sugar Ray Robinson, Hearns, Haglar and a host of others would have taken those fights cause they got heart for proving themselves in the ring and not building up their win-loss record. The time has pass. Those guys have moved up or slower and older.

Right now, I don't think Money is dodging PacMan because he's afraid. He would have fought PacMan earlier this year. PacMan has too many weaknesses. Money's uncle may go to prison and he knows PacMan will be busy next year with his duties as an elected government body. Next year PacMan will be weak and prime for the taking when Money will be at full steam. I think this is just smart on Money's part.

[Asian Sabrina]

Well me being a Filipina, I want Pacquiao to win if Mayweather and him ever fight.

[Don T. Lukbak]

Originally Posted by Rambro Creed

But he's YOUR kind of fighter and person, by all means continue sucking up to him.

Nope, I already said his emphasis on defense is not "my style"; i.e., doesn't make for a rousing, adrenaline pumper. It does, however, drive his adversaries batshit....and it's damn hard to elude punches the way he does. Damn near impossible. Most people don't understand that, however...people with first hand experience at how friggin' hard boxing is have all but died out. People nowadays can watch a virtuoso performance and have no clue whatsoever. How else can you explain a pseudo-sport like MMA? Well, at least MMA fans don't need to know bupkis about their "sport" to enjoy it. Did you enjoy Chris Byrd fights? Alexis Arguello? How they did what they did still mystifies me. They fought as the opposites of Evander, and Leon Spinks ... who just flatfooted out center ring and started trading, which I also loved. But HEY, who doesn't?

Your saying he runs is what they used to say about Cassius Clay. Your implying that his technique somehow just ain't cricket is like saying basketball died when they started allowing dunkshots.

Watching Pacquiao fight is a helluva lot more fun..it's like he's solving a problem. Can he solve Mayweather? Beats me. I'll be cheering for Pac, not because I dislike Mayweather but because there's just something about slippery little bastards like him that makes a person want to feed him a left hook followed by a honking overhand right, I can't do it..so Pac's my proxy. But the urge to stick Mayweather shouldn't be confused with disrespect for him, or his skills, which become inseparable in the ring. Boxing at any level is hard drill...and especially when your every opponent is capable of killing the average man with one punch.

Mayweather, the man? I don't know a thing about him. But I do believe he is an American and it's nobody's business but his what he does with his earnings. Same as for any rap asshole you want to discuss, so long as he earns his money legally and it's not some government plunder paid out as a grant to "the arts".

Hell, it's his right even if he wants to do something really stupid with it like contribute to Democrats. Nobody's business but his! That seems to drive you nuts, Creed...remember, envy is the deadliest of the deadly sins.

[Randall Creed]

Ahh, so my reasons for not liking him, which IMO are very similar to yours, are envy (and yours aren't)? Please. I don't like Charles Manson, the Philadelphia Eagles, or Republicans either, and none of it has anything to do with envy.

Again, it's one thing to dodge punches via bobbing and weaving. It's a completely different matter to suckerpunch and run. I mean, we're watching a sport where two people are trying to knock each other out. There's a CONFRONTATIONAL element to the sport that makes it exist. Mano-e-mano, toe to toe. Whatever you wanna call it. Making it a chicken chase is bullshit, and that's not what the people pay to see.

Yes, the dude has ability. Great. I get that. However, I've seen enough of his fights to know that a majority of his 'defense' is not to get hit. Before you say it, I know no one wants to get hit. Duh. I get that, too. But that's kinda like a football team that has mastered the onside kick to keep the ball because they are morbidly horrific at playing defense. What I'm saying is Mayweather's defensive style (running based) basically goes against the FABRIC (being confrontational) of the sport. Because of this, it's hard to justify a decision over him because he's not hit enough in any fights, yet is able to onesie twosie punch the opponent enough to win. The reason he won't fight Pacquiao just yet is because he hasn't figured out how to run from him.

I will say this, though. If you feel like you can't be beat(en), you'll fight ANYBODY. When you've gotten enough money over the years it becomes lesser of an object to you. Doubt creates hesitance. 'Money', at the very least, DOUBTS he can beat Pacq.

[Don T. Lukbak]

Originally Posted by Rambro Creed

'Money' Mayweather is a chauvinistic PIG who literally throws his money around...in the 'I'm paid and you're not' kind of way. Basically the same way rappers do it, and we all hate them for that, don't we (among other reasons)?

If this ain't the raving of an envious man, well it's just gonna have to do.

You might hate 'em Creed, but I don't. Unless, that is, one of them fucks with me directly. Everything would change at that point.

Mayweather may be a jerk, he may be an excellent cat...I just don't know the dude. I asked whether you did, but since you haven't deigned to answer I guess you don't either.

What I have become certain of, however, is the fact you are entirely innocent of any knowledge of or experience in the sweet science. Congratulations on your nose remaining in the center of your face. I'll guess you can go get glasses fitted without the optician ejaculating "Holy Shit"...your nose is moved 6 mm right of centerline! I envy you that. I'm also willing to guess your commentary on any MMA fight will be as perspicacious as any "expert's" opinion.

[Don T. Lukbak]

Originally Posted by Rambro Creed

I've seen enough of his fights to know that a majority of his 'defense' is not to get hit.

...and the remainder of his "defense" is....? I confess I'm stumped, Mr. Creed. I always imagined that 100% of defense was for the purpose of not getting hit.

It is real hard to hit back if your opponent has crossed your eyes and you now have 2 swinging on you, or if you tell your legs to go here and your damn legs tell you to go fuck yourself.

But back to the fight: it has all the makings of a fox vs hedgehog classic. If the fox (Pac) can solve the hedgehog (Mayweather), I really want to see how he does it. I think he's going to have to dream up some way to lure Mayweather into lunging into him...it could be Pac getting a little bit hurt and fooling Mayweather into thinking he needs to step in and finish him off. I really would like to see that before I go.

[allofamber]

Its done...Pac.. wont fight that punk Mayweather..Pac's last fight for 2010 will be with Antonio Margarito...seriously?...this is only about getting a check..dude still hasnt even gotten a license to fight in Vegas.....MAYWEATHER IS A FU*KING PUNK!!!!

[Randall Creed]

Lol.
I don't know him personally. We've yet to sit at a bar and chug down some beers and all. But every time I see him on TV, he's got to let everyone know how PAID he is, how he's NEVER LOST, that he's too GOOD LOOKING to get hit, so on and so forth. I don't know anyone who DOESN'T see these character flaws in him...except you, who seems more intent on simply opposing me than reading what I'm saying.

[Merlin]

I am not a big Mayweather fan for one thing. I hadn't chimed in because I haven't had internet access on my laptop for over a month. I defended Mayweather earlier because I don't think he is scared of Pacquaio and I still don't believe that to be the case now.

Mayweather marches to his own drummer and when they gave him a deadline to accept the fight, that was the beginning of the end. Mayweather is going to fight on his terms and you are not going to send him a list of demands with a deadline if you seriously want to fight him. Not to mention that he can still generate big money fights without fighting Pacquaio. The money he made off the Mosley fight versus what Pacquio generated off his last fight is significant. If the fight goes down, it will be on Mayweather's terms not vice versa. Not gonna argue whether that is right or wrong, it is what it is.

Having said that, I wished that the fight would have went down. It even appears that the drug testing wasn't an issue.

[Don T. Lukbak]

Originally Posted by Merlin

I am not a big Mayweather fan for one thing. I hadn't chimed in because I haven't had internet access on my laptop for over a month. I defended Mayweather earlier because I don't think he is scared of Pacquaio and I still don't believe that to be the case now.

Mayweather marches to his own drummer and when they gave him a deadline to accept the fight, that was the beginning of the end. Mayweather is going to fight on his terms and you are not going to send him a list of demands with a deadline if you seriously want to fight him. Not to mention that he can still generate big money fights without fighting Pacquaio. The money he made off the Mosley fight versus what Pacquia generated off his last fight is significant. If the fight goes down, it will be on Mayweather's terms not vice versa. Not gonna argue whether that os right or wrong, it is what it is.

Having said that, I wished that the fight would have went down. It even appears that the drug testing wasn't an issue.

I completely agree with this. The contest will have been many months, or a year or two, ongoing the second those two enter the ring to begin the physical phase. Training to peak at just the right time is already hard enough without somebody building a squirrel's nest in your head. Not to mention running for political office. Sheesh, I'm gonna go lay down now.

[htownhammer]

Originally Posted by Don T. Lukbak

He was drafted, same as Elvis. Unlike Elvis, however, he refused 3 times to take the step forward at the call of his name at the induction center here in Houston in 1967. Before that I was his biggest fan. I even bet a buddy he would serve, and lost. After that, fuck the sorry bastard!

I don't want to hijack this thread. However, I can't let this go. Ali refused to go in as a form of civil protest primarily to the denial of basic human rights, civil rights, and inhumane treatment suffered by African Americans in this country at the time. Unlike Elvis, he and others of his race were denied the full rights, benefits, and privileges of this country's citizenhip but expected to serve and sacrifice for this country. If you ignore this aspect of his refusal or don't think it's a worthy cause, then I guess he is merely a draft dodger.

[Don T. Lukbak]

Originally Posted by htownhammer

I don't want to hijack this thread. However, I can't let this go. Ali refused to go in as a form of civil protest primarily to the denial of basic human rights, civil rights, and inhumane treatment suffered by African Americans in this country at the time. Unlike Elvis, he and others of his race were denied the full rights, benefits, and privileges of this country's citizenhip but expected to serve and sacrifice for this country. If you ignore this aspect of his refusal or don't think it's a worthy cause, then I guess he is merely a draft dodger.

I agree with your description of the social pathology of the early 1960's, but I must respectfully disagree with you about Ali's motivation. By then America had made him a wealthy man, with full benefits of citizenship and then some. I believe he evaded his duty because he was Elijah Muhammed's puppet, and it was in Elijah Muhammed's interest to sow the seeds of discord throughout America generally, and specifically to undermine Dr. Martin Luther King, Jr., who encouraged AA's to be loyal and dutiful American citizens secure in the belief their time would come. As I recall, Elijah Muhammed's bunch ridiculed Dr. King at their every opportunity.

You may also recall he had previously evaded the draft for more than a year by scoring low on an intelligence test ... I do not buy the notion that his intelligence was anywhere near as low as that test said it was; in fact, not low at all; but if his opposition to serving was principled as you said it was, then why did he first try to flunk the entry, as I believe he must have done? I don't believe his opposition to serving was based on any principle other than self-preservation. That was common in those days; when Nixon ended the draft is exactly when all the "high-minded pacifists" stopped their stupid protest marches.

I took it very personal when he refused...before that I loved the guy. Hell, I waited outside KCOH for a couple hours for him to finish up on Skipper Lee so I could go shake his hand. Not any more, baby. Him, and Jane Fonda! Two of a kind as far as I'm concerned. Where I grew up anyone who evaded service at that time might as well move...or kill themselves because they would have been from that day forward ostracized. White or black, we were all very close.

I can only imagine what a schmuck I would feel like were I black and serving at the very moment Ali voted "present" and refused to take the step.

I do respect your opinion, though, HH. I don't recall your ever posting irresponsible or inaccurate crap. With that in mind, I intend to go back and revisit the conclusion I formed 43? years ago ... never had much occasion to think on it much since then until now.

I think we can agree he was a hell of a fighter, with plenty of courage in the ring, and he stood up to some hellacious beatings. He also was very kind to my buddy, Cleveland Williams, after he got fucked by Bud Adams. Didn't give him any financial help, though. By the way, Cleveland served honorably, in the Army, I think, before he moved to Houston. He was pretty sad about Ali's refusal too..I think...he didn't do a lot of talking, but he didn't seem too happy about it. That was a long time ago and my memory seems vivid, but I also know how memories are often tricky. Big Cat got run down in traffic just outside the Med Center on his way for dialysis. 1999.

[Mojojo]

Originally Posted by allofamber

Its done...Pac.. wont fight that punk Mayweather..Pac's last fight for 2010 will be with Antonio Margarito...seriously?...this is only about getting a check..dude still hasnt even gotten a license to fight in Vegas.....MAYWEATHER IS A FU*KING PUNK!!!!

I thought Pac agreed to the testing?

[Merlin]

Originally Posted by Don T. Lukbak

I agree with your description of the social pathology of the early 1960's, but I must respectfully disagree with you about Ali's motivation. By then America had made him a wealthy man, with full benefits of citizenship and then some. I believe he evaded his duty because he was Elijah Muhammed's puppet, and it was in Elijah Muhammed's interest to sow the seeds of discord throughout America generally, and specifically to undermine Dr. Martin Luther King, Jr., who encouraged AA's to be loyal and dutiful American citizens secure in the belief their time would come. As I recall, Elijah Muhammed's bunch ridiculed Dr. King at their every opportunity.

You may also recall he had previously evaded the draft for more than a year by scoring low on an intelligence test ... I do not buy the notion that his intelligence was anywhere near as low as that test said it was; in fact, not low at all; but if his opposition to serving was principled as you said it was, then why did he first try to flunk the entry, as I believe he must have done? I don't believe his opposition to serving was based on any principle other than self-preservation. That was common in those days; when Nixon ended the draft is exactly when all the "high-minded pacifists" stopped their stupid protest marches.

I took it very personal when he refused...before that I loved the guy. Hell, I waited outside KCOH for a couple hours for him to finish up on Skipper Lee so I could go shake his hand. Not any more, baby. Him, and Jane Fonda! Two of a kind as far as I'm concerned. Where I grew up anyone who evaded service at that time might as well move...or kill themselves because they would have been from that day forward ostracized. White or black, we were all very close.

I can only imagine what a schmuck I would feel like were I black and serving at the very moment Ali voted "present" and refused to take the step.

I do respect your opinion, though, HH. I don't recall your ever posting irresponsible or inaccurate crap. With that in mind, I intend to go back and revisit the conclusion I formed 43? years ago ... never had much occasion to think on it much since then until now.

I think we can agree he was a hell of a fighter, with plenty of courage in the ring, and he stood up to some hellacious beatings. He also was very kind to my buddy, Cleveland Williams, after he got fucked by Bud Adams. Didn't give him any financial help, though. By the way, Cleveland served honorably, in the Army, I think, before he moved to Houston. He was pretty sad about Ali's refusal too..I think...he didn't do a lot of talking, but he didn't seem too happy about it. That was a long time ago and my memory seems vivid, but I also know how memories are often tricky. Big Cat got run down in traffic just outside the Med Center on his way for dialysis. 1999.

Ali wasn't anyone's puppet. I don't have any problems with him refusing to serve in that war and I have my reasons for believing that, just like you don't have a problem with an avatar that ridicules the president of the United States. If he was another color, I doubt it would have been such an issue.

The problem I have with Ali was how he treated Joe Frazier. He played on all the stereotypes. I am sure it was just business for him but I guess he never realized how insulting that was for Joe who still hasn't gotten over it.

[allofamber]

Originally Posted by mojojo213

I thought Pac agreed to the testing?

He DID...PAC agreed to EVERYTHING Maypunk asked for...the contract was ready...and Maypunk wouldn't sign it!!!!!!!! So Pac took another fight..like I already said it's just a paycheck.....PAC wasn't going to waste the end of the year..plus who doesn't need more CASH.....oh yea that's right MAYPUNK!!!!!

OMG I'm so angry!!!! I even bought a big screen after MAYPUNK's last fight cause I convinced that this fight was GOING to happen......God help Maypunk if I ever see him in public...his punkass owes me A LOT of money on this TV!!!!!!